Veterans and Dreadnoughts. The information from both of these, comes out of the latest White Dwarf.

The question about drop pods has been finally answered, and that is a yes, as apparently they are listed under the veteran list of what is available for transports. I would assume as well that Dark Angel Tacticals will get them as well.


via jullevi over on Warseer
Company veterans (4+1 models, with up to 5 additional)

Any model: Chainsword
Up to three models: Storm bolter, Combi-weapon, Power weapon, Lightning claw, Plasma pistol, Power fist or Pair of lightning claws
Any model: Combat shield, Melta bombs, Storm shield
One in every 5 models: Flamer, Melta gun, Plasma gun
One model: Heavy bolter, Multi-melta, Missile launcher, Plasma cannon or Lascannon
Dedicated transport: Drop Pod, Rhino or Razorback


via Faeit 212 from a source that wants to remain anonymous
Something that was missed for veterans above and some more Dreadnought options

Veterans
Can take flakk missiles

Dreadnought (elite choice)
Can take a drop pod
Can replace its multi-melta with
Twin-linked Autocannon
Twin-linked Flamer
Twin-linked Heavy Bolter
Plasma Cannon
Assualt Cannon
Lascannon

Can replace its other arm with
Missile Launcher
Twin-linked Autocannon

Can replace the built in storm bolter with a heavy flamer

Can be upgraded to Venerable and if does it gets the special rule,
Deathwing Vehicle

48 Comments:

  1. sadly, the vets look so generic now...

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    1. jeah... hope they at least go down in points on a massivlly... otherwise they will still scuk

      flamer dread could be nice
      the rest is just the same as any SM dex -.-

      i guess DW vehicle means it will not die & an inv save. Dont expect that to be too cheap

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    2. I would imagine this is so DA don't get all the toys - presume vanilla marines will keep vets with lots of special weapons

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    3. Generic? How are they different than what they were in the past?
      It'd be nice to having something special about them like what Purifiers, Sanguinary Guard or other unique power armor elites have but at least its better than "DERP here is the sternguard, enjoy having things that make vanilla marines unique plus extra dark/blood/psi units."

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    4. I kind of see what you're getting at, but I think that if DA got some crazy Dark Angely type PA elite unit, they would just get too much stuff - They already have Deathwing & Ravenwing, which are where most of the DA vets go, they don't really need more.

      You can still fill the vets full of those combi-weapons, and given that DA are looking to get those extra plasma rules, I would imagine that combi-plasma vets might be DA's "Flavour" - i.e. they do combi-plasma vets better than all the other codexes.

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    5. Eh, combi-weapons are more Chaos' thing.

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  2. Dreadnoughts seem pretty standard, but as for Veteran, I guess they're some what pseudo Sternguard? But not quite as awesome, if you ask me.

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    1. jop
      and prob not quit as cheap in points

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  3. Replies
    1. vanilla marines need something to make them unique. I'm glad company vets are similar to before and not broken down into van and sternguard tho. what does this mean for the mortis dread rumours. false or a hs choice? I'm thinking false at this stage.

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    2. Yes, Vanilla Marines need to remain uniquely bland and terrible.

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    3. Vanilla marines were pretty good.
      Until Ward gave all of their stuff to everyone else at half price.

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    4. Thats not what happen.... he copy the stuff of the others at double price... thats a fact.

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    5. Not only no Iron Clads, but no goddamn Mortis Dreadnought! What the frak... dual autocannons does not a Mortis make. I am sick to death of never being able to use the dual missile launcher dreadnoughts (three of them!) that I have had since 19-FRAKING-96 because the "community" wants to ignore Imperial Armour.

      Gorram it, GW. Just... gorram it.

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    6. Hey ISH....how bout you calm down for half a second. If you did that, you might realise that Imperial Armour is allowed to be freely mixed with 6th edition 40k now. So hang tight, keep your buttons in a row, and wait for a 6th edition update for whatever book they're in, or just assume that they have the same number of HP as any other dreadnought and play on. If anyone you play games against says IA isn't "legal", simply laugh and tell them they're kidding themselves and that it's time to wake up.

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  4. The Veteran bit seems off to me, it is more or less a slightly modified version of what is in the current Dex WITHOUT the errata. Right now all vets can take stormbolters in place of their chainsword. I hope this is not going away as rolling half blocks of dice with space marines works very well (duh!) At the very least, if we are going this route I hope it becomes a Bolter replacement while be able to retain pistol/chainsword combo for the +1 attack.

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  5. The Veterans seem unappealing unless they upgrades have been discounted.

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  6. I hope this information about the Vets in wrong, I really really want the special ammunition on my vets. If not, I really do not see why you would not just run terminators.

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    1. That's a very good point. As they're listed here there's no reason to take vets on PA instead of TDA. That is, unless they get access to special issue ammunition too.

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    2. Sure there is. 1squad of plasma vets to pod down alongside the deathwing squads to creat more of a target priority issue. You have to think outside the cut and paste box

      Do you kill the plasma toting Marines who will melt you or do you kill the death wing terminators who will next turn crash in to you and smash you to pieces.

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    3. drop poding a bunch of vets with combi-meltas and special ammo also causes an issue of target priority and they're not going to blow themselves up before the my opponent's shooting phase.

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    4. i'd have more issues with 2 squads of TDA.

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    5. Pending final points and rules, seems a better option to shoot all that plasma T1 via Devs, DW or that odd plasma speeder thing. Even these new RW bikers have a sort of TL plasmaguns

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    6. @ alex
      You can do that now... The rules & options are the Same as now.... And that Pod tactic you Talk about does Not work. Becaus After that 1 Turn they dont so much anymore. They are just overpriced Marines Not half as Good as sternguard.
      So yes you rather want to spend 60 points more and get Termis

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  7. No Mortis dreads is a vast vast failure on the part of the vetock. I really don't like the way this book is begging to look. i would have waited another year so they didn't have to be the "experimental SM codex" again.

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    1. Agreed - it is a part of what made DA different, but alas it looks like it is gone and the great Riflemen Dread is the only Mortis type pattern that matters.

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    2. did you guys not read the post? there is an option there for double TL Autocannons. Is that not a Mortis Pattern? also, isn't the forge world entry already legal?

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    3. The dual Autocannon is but ONE option for the Mortis-pattern (which has been part of DA signautre equipment since `96 with Codex: Angels of Death; predating the Baal Predator and Furioso Dreadnought). But it has been stuck in Imperial Armour Vol. 2 since that book was published.

      Although Forge World units are 100% a part of the WH40k game, many people in the "community" consider them to be unofficial and will not let anyone use these units. Which is a pain in the mivonks for those of us that prefer to use the full rules to this game.

      The Mortis-pattern has many option beyound dual autocannons, such as dual heavy bolters, dual lascannons, or (my favorite) dual missile launchers. I have three dual missile Dreads in my collection, dating back to `96, and I almost never get to use them.

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    4. There was no Mortis Pattern Dreadnought. Just as there were no Furioso. The list says "Dreadnought Weapons.
      Dreadnoughts may be armed with any two of the following weapons. Note this list includes some weaponary not available on the standard models,but which are given here for the benefit of converters and modellers. Se the section on Dreadnoughts. All Dreadnought weapons have Targeters."

      Ther is no mention of Mortis or Furioso. Yes you could make them. BUT you needed your opponents permision to use them in a game. Unlike Forgeworld now-a-days. You could also have all terminator armies for ANY chapter. Ultramarines used an all terminator force, Blood angels have a whole GAME about thier all terminator forces actions in the Sin of Damnation. Dark Angels got a supplement to that entire game about their all terminator forces inception. The Imperial fists under Lysander used an all terminator force in an action in the Space Marine Codex..blah blah blah.

      All those arguing about fluff not being upheld or that such and such should be there and is not...chill. Some one some where can probably argue against what you are saying.

      On TOPIC:- I hope this is not accurate, it should allow previous options to continue (all power armoured Stormshielded squads :D). I would find it odd if they negated a choice you used to have even if that was from an errata. That being said...I have a silly amount of Darkangels (Deathwing, Ravenwing, 3rd, 4th and half the 5th company, a dozen dreadnoughts and I still dont have more than 1 squad of company veterans. Even then, my company Veterans are modeled and painted as Deathwatch To fit in my Blood Angels and Imperial Fist armies.

      PS Yes. The Deathwing. 100 teminators. Though I will sell some old metals and conversions and Get the new plastics. And The Ravenwing...though half of them seem to have gone on an indefinite scouting mission and disappeared.

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  8. oh my god... what is this crap? copy-paste from the old dex?

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  9. do we know what the deathwing vehicle rule does yet?

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  10. Company Veterans look like the current squad...
    They are not bad but still not good enough compared to DW knights and RW black knights...
    The dread looks like the vanilla one with the addition of the DW VEICHLE special rule to the venerable variant...
    I guess that i will fill the elite slots with DW and RW and the only PA will be tacticals (with scouts) in troops...

    Master Sheol

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  11. Bolt pistol/plasma pistol gunfighters with a heavy bolter and storm shields. Dropping out of a pod With a librarian and shooting elite choices to death.

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    1. You had an idea until you said heavy bolter. Those things are just not worth it. :)

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    2. Heavy bolter is great for a stand and shoot squad. Specially if the librarian is rolling divination.

      This is on top of the 3 plasma pistols, and 2 plasmaguns. In a 10 man squad that's 7 plasma shots, 11 bolter shots And 3 heavy bolter shots. To deal with. Can't really be ignored.

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    3. well, coming out of the drop pod, you can't use divination since it happens at the beginning of the movement phase and I doubt that squad will be alive on you're next turn so I'd suggest dropping it all together. Also, this squad is incredibly expensive for what is basically a one time use squad. A smart player is going to be in cover to get cover saves.

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  12. And of you made it this far in the thread you will see a perfect example of the Doom and Gloom that happens before the release of every codex that has come out.

    Remember the 5 stages of Nerd reaction to the release of new products.
    1) There is a rumor that there will be a new Codex. There is Excitement for those who own the army.
    2) Early rumors come out and there is Denial that there will be a release and all the leaked info is wrong. (This is one of the most rational stages.)
    3) White Dwarf leaks emerge and there is a great scream of Anger and Sadness becuase everything is going to now suck becuase they have been nerfed or didn't get the toys rumored early on.
    4) There will then be a period of the sense of Loss that will remain for about two months after the release of the Codex.
    5) Then comes acceptance and Excitement again as players learn to play with the new Codex instead of trying to make the army work as it did in the old Codex.

    This will last till the next Codex starts it all over again.

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    1. Haha that's so true.

      I love the "i want what vanilla Marines have, our units suck" followed by the "wth we aren't vanilla marines why aren't we more unique"

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  13. i want dreadnoughts to have the option for skyfire / interceptor.

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    1. you'll get whirlwind rockets for that.

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  14. GW is a miniatures company. They are releasing new elite units for DW and RW, thus they have no financial incentive to encourage players to field older models in the elite slot that many people already have (e.g. Dreads and green Power Armor). Furthermore, Dark Angels must be built as a unique brand that is easily distinguishable from the regular Blue Marines. The easiest way to accomplish this is by focusing on the DW and RW and not the Green Marines.

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  15. all of this info is from dr. who over at wsrseer.
    It's from the january WD. Two pages of the elites section are in one of the pictures. Jullevi is correct in his summation. Points wise you are in the Chaos Chosen ballpark. They also have the 'Grim Resolve' special rule, whatever that is, in addition to their normal SM rules. No mention of special ammo options and you have to exchange your bolter for the chainsword - no Grey Hunter wannabees here! The Storm Shield option looks oddly cheap (as in criminally cheap). And yes, they are Elites.Let me get my magnifying glass and see whatever else I can gleam.....On Deathwing Terminators (Elite):A little more expensive (not much) than your average Astartes version but you get Deathwing Assault, Splitfire USR, Inner Circle and Vengeful Strike special rules thrown in to the bargain. You can pretty much customize the squad anyway you like. They start out as a standard tactical squad but you can upgrade any number of them to assault terminators with either a pair of lightning claws (free) or the omnipresent thunderhammer and storm shield combo (you must pay for that privilege). For every 5 models (you can have a max of 10) you get the option of a heavy flamer, plasma cannon, assault cannon or cyclone missile launcher (no flakk option). You can also have the usual dedicated Land Raider but if you do, then you must pay for the Deathwing Vehicle upgrade which is mandatory. If there is an option to make them a troop choice, it resides within the character section.On Deathwing Knights (Elite):Again a little more expensive than normal Deathwing Terminators (still not much). They have +1 WS, Maces of Absolution and Storm Shields as standard except the Knights Master. He has the Flail of the Unforgiven instead of the mace, and as far as I can make out, also +1 attack (don't quote me on that one). They also have a king's ransom of special rules: Deathwing Assualt, Hammer of Wrath, Inner Circle, Fortress of Shields and You Cannot Hide. The last two were a little hard to make out, so I'm 100% sure on those. The Smite rule is not mentioned by name but I think it is part of the weapon special rules. They can also be given a '... Relic of the Unforgiven' (the '...' part I cannot decipher) and a Land Raider which must have the Deathwing vehicle upgrade as well.On Dreadnoughts (Elite):Now cheaper! Same price as the Chaos Helbrute but with a free Storm Bolter! Same options as the Astartes version - including the Rifleman option but the Dreadnought close combat weapon has been replaced with a powerfist. The Venerable Dreadnought is now an upgrade. I don't have my books but I think it is a lot cheaper than before (still hard to make out, but it looks like the price of a powerfist). The Venerable also get the Deathwing Vehicle rule as standard it seems. No mention of Mortis options.On Landspeeders:Their Bestiary page is also in the WD. The Vengeance version has a heavy bolter and a Plasma Storm battery as standard. Otherwise it is you standard Land Speeder. The Ravenwing Darkshroud version is a Land Speeder with a heavy bolter and it has the Scout USR apparantly. It also has (or has the option for) the 'Icon of Old Caliban' which gives +1 to friendly units within 12" when determining assualt results (not cumulative). The Darkshroud special rule gives the Land Speeder the Shrouded USR and friendly units within 6" gain the Stealth USR (not cumulative, does not affect the Darkshroud itself).The codex is mentioned as being 104 pages long. It think that is all I can contribute. The battle report (and pretty much all other articles) is not really informative when it comes to rules. In fact the seem to go out of their way to avoid mentioning them!

    there looks to be some special rules we have yet to hear about yet!

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  16. oops, the wall of text was originally broken into sections until I copied and pasted, sorry!

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  17. Dunno if you'll see this Natfka but looking closer at the GW pictures it seems the terminator box makes the knights and also includes a cyclone (inset pictures). The interesting thing is the flyer box that has an inset that makes it look like a dual kit!

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    1. I confirm...
      All DA new boxes are multi kits...
      DW box makes DW standard squad, DW command squad and DW knights...
      RW box makes RW command squad and black knights...
      Flyer box makes darktalon and nephilim...
      LS box makes LS vengeance and DarkShroud...

      Master Sheol

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    2. I'm ready to order 200 more rare earth magnets

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  18. I'm a bit upset that the Dreadnought Missile Launcher seems to still just be a normal Missile Launcher, it seems absolutely idiotic to me that it can't match the output of a Typhoon or Cyclone.

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