Ever since the first rumors slipped out on this beast, (a big thanks to Grant), we have looked forward to what this monstrosity was going to bring to the tabletop. The idea of huge mutated machines, manipulated and controlled by the Warpsmith's is an incredibly fun idea. So lets take a closer look at the heldrake is.
via White Dwarf Daily (Link for pre-orders)
The Heldrake is the flying daemonic abomination of the Chaos Space Marines. What was once a metal machine with a human pilot has become corrupted and ravaged by the Chaos Gods, mutated and morphed into something entirely different. Daemonic flesh writhes beneath armoured wings, mechanical umbilicals stream behind it and vicious talons have grown where a landing gear would once have been. The human pilot is still inside somewhere, a sacrifice to the Chaos Gods and the mortal heart of the daemonic machine that now swoops down upon its foes.
The Heldrake is not the most heavily armed flying unit in Warhammer 40,000, though as Adam found out in October's battle report, the baleflamer protruding from it's jaw was incredibly effective when aimed at his power armoured White Scars.
Can't wait for this kit!
ReplyDeleteWait for what this Release sucks a few upgrade sprews and this IT why aren't we getting the same love as Dark Eldar Necrons Blood angels all we got were a few stinking upgrade sprews and gw WANTS TO CHARGE US ALOT .
Deleteand the fiends and the heldrake and five new characters and technically the dark vengeance stuff...
Deletei hope it looks better in real life than in the pics. to me, i really feel that they should have added a longer tail cos now it just looks funny. i have been wrong in the past and i hope im wrong this time
DeleteA lot is two words bro.
Delete^If you're going to ba a grammar nazi at least talk about something related too....
DeletePersonally, I can't wait for it either. I can see why people don't like it (I.E. its rather Dinobot-like)but it's the pose that I want to change. If it looked more like Jes Goodwin's concepts in WD I'd have no problem with it. It seems to have a longer body in his early design.
It looks cool enough though it seems as if it should have gone to chaos Daemons, and that chaos space marines should have gotten a fighter jet of some kind.
Deletehow in hell can anyone not like this as a chaos marine player I started when I was 9 and have been colecting only chaos since last year now I have trator guard n eldar ive been colecting for 13 years this is the best and most detailed kit there is look at how mutated dark vengence is this is the same same as the new kits chaos is getting better theres so much more colour now then a plan marine, this is chaos corrupted to hell just like it should be Ave dominus nox DEATH TO THE FALSE EMPOROR marines will die in squads flyers will burn and the dragon will recover its wounds if it get shot
Deletedoes it not look kinda unbalance to you? like its gonna tip forward...
DeleteMy idea is to grab the bits for the cockpit and tail of the storm talon and do some kitbashing to make a hellblade, which is what we SHOULD have gotten in this codex, out of this trash.
DeleteBale flamer on this is going to be the clear winner. CSM have other things to deal with flyers, like forge fiends with 3 hades auto cannons or havocs with flak missiles
ReplyDeleteNot sure the Forgefiend can take 3 Hades Cannons, nor do I think it is Skyfire. So it will be 8 shots at BS1... Then again the Dragon can vector strike which I think will be a better AA.
DeleteVector strike a flier then flamer some troops, ???, profit!
Deleteim taking the easy option and having some traitor guard allies with some traitor hydras
DeleteIt has a gun head and can get 3 plasma so why not 3 hades?
Delete12 shots should be two hits on average
If you are taking the hell drake as anti air, then you should take the hades. Average 2 hits with that on most flyers is a good chance to wreck it, I just think the marine melting killyness of the bale flamer is a better option. You can earn your points back with that a lot easier than with the hades.
DeleteI think that havocs and forgefiends will be plenty enough AA. Against aircraft 12 s8 shots is going to be about as effective as 3 non psy bolt riflemen dreads
Agreed with the Baleflamer, it will be much easier to make up points roasting marines with the flamer than trying to knock enemy Air out of the sky.
DeleteAnd you can still vector strike and get lucky while you're doing it. In addition, against non-marine armies the baleflamer will be quite mean. Incubi finally got their teeth back with the latest FAQs and once you open their raider one of these could handle them nicely (and deny FNP to anything T3).
I was on the fence for a long time with this one, then off, then back on... but I think I finally found a definite role for it.
I was actually going to be disappointed by the Heldrake if it couldn't breathe fire. Since it can, I am all about it.
DeleteAnd yes, vector strike the fliers, roast the marines.
still ugly
ReplyDeleteI agree, I'm not particularly fond of this model. Just a bit over the top. Looks more "mech" than "chaos", then again I suspect GW is trying to show a more distinct difference between CSM and Daemons.
Deleteagreed... THe Forge World models are a better call.. If anything this ugly drake is more of a chaos daemon...
DeleteThe forgefiends on the other hand are very well done.
Any ideas on what to use as a Death Guard version of the hell drake? I like it and all but it so doesn't fit into a DG army.
DeleteI guess anything really actually thinking about it. You can't really model for advantage with a flyer this big can you?
DeleteMaybe something along the line of this but more meched up. Always wanted to make one of these as well after seeing it. So awesome!
http://www.gamesworkshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1950077a_Blog010911_1_XL.jpg
It grew on me.. But for me beauty is in function.
DeleteWrong link sorry. I mean the nurgle fly on this page..
Deletehttp://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/blogPost.jsp?aId=18000005a
If it has Vector Dancer, then I will get it. Otherwise its really no good.
DeleteMaybe use a blight drone instead. Kind of an expensive swap but I think they are about the same size.
DeleteThe tail section has the appearance of flesh so you can paint it a rotting or bruised skin color. the wings and carapace can either be painted a rust or discolored metal color over deathguard white, grey, or green to make it look like its faded from years of use or decay. you could also cut off the feet claws and replace them with fleshy tentacles made of green stuff
DeleteYea I'll probably Chaosify a Stormraven. This isn't attractive or contextual at all, especially for simple renegade chapters that don't want anything (or this much) to do with the warp/chaos/etc.
Deletelove all the high angle shots to hide its awful gaping "exhaust port"
ReplyDeleteThis kit reminds of a Transformer toy and not in a good way. Good thing forge world makes some nice looking Chaos flyers that can proxy for it.
ReplyDeleteHellblade/talons vector striking?
DeleteUse the Helldrake miniature or go back to Battlefield 3 with your Jet ramming.
Hmmm... no. Better to image Hellblade/talon vector srike than looking at Helldrake.
DeleteYeah this things got 2claws on its shoulders a hellblade is covered in blades and ever looks like a gigantic blade
Deletethis thing is the lost dinobot. Terrible. Are they hoping to use it in WHFB too?
ReplyDeleteI didn't know they had Hell Talons in WHFB.
DeleteThe more I see the kit, the less impressed I am. It's huge! Which is a good think, and with the "wings" being an almost identical match, I can only hope GW took the Hellblade kit from FW and are going to make it available.
ReplyDeleteDinobots! Transform!
ReplyDeleteDark Vengeance was fantastic but now new Chaos is big freaking disapointment...
Exactly
DeleteYeah its pretty crazy, on one side we get some of the best sculpted minis i've ever seen in the starter set and now its back to square 1 again.... Must of put all of their effort into that set..... weird
DeleteI like the concept. I like how it performed in the WD battle report. And I really like the model from the neck down. I just don't like that the head is a straight-forward dragon. It is not distinctly chaos.
ReplyDeleteIn 40k there are dragon motifs in a variety of non-chaos armies and otherwise not much in chaos armies aside from Alpha Legion. The head should have a more daemonic look. The notion of a mutated flyer is great. The notion that its mouth is the main gun is also great. That it looks like a big fantasy dragon is just off. I'll be interested to see what folks do with conversions of this thing.
On caliban, didn't the knights fight dragons that we're basically chaos beasts? I really dig this kit. My issue is going to be fitting it in with the rest of the awesome stuff chaos is getting :)
ReplyDeleteThe rules dont make it how it sgould be. A baleflamer is good butwont do anything to flyers. St7 vectorstriking is weak since its 5 to pen flyers and cant hurt av14.
ReplyDeletePersonally i feel like you pay 170 for its defemse capabilities thanits offensive ones.
Still a cool model but we'll see
Umm there are no flyers that have above armor 10 rear armor
DeleteStorm Raven, Caestus, Storm Talon to name a few.
DeleteNecrons are 11 11 11
DeleteHa, is the necron flyer a binary pun with its armour values?
DeleteIf it were a binary pun it would be more like
Delete101010
There's no flier that has av14 or av13, so a 5-6 to pen is actually decent, and remember that 4's also still glance to remove hull points, and that gets easier when going against Necron or Dark Eldar fliers.
DeleteAlso, the trouble with the autocannon is that when you vector strike something, you go past it. You can't turn around and also shoot it, so unless you're facing specifically the necron flier list, you're not going to be shooting that autocannon at enemy fliers anyway.
Im talking about av14 like if this would be something id take even if i knew there wouldnt be any flyers.
DeleteOh well i just get a Forgefiend with 3 plasma cannons, and use Anrakyrs MiTM to make it fire 6 plasma blasts a turn :)
But that's just it. With the str 6 ap 3 deny cover template, you're going to be decimating troops, swathes of them! You can remove them from that pesky Quad gun, take them off objectives, down the Havocs and Longfangs before they become an issue!
DeleteEveryone like dead Long Fangs! Personally, I think this is pretty greats, an inferno cannon woth torrent and soulblaze(?), on a flier that can vector strike at S7 - and personally, I actually think it looks pretty awesome, the Black Legion one looked kinda ugly in the WD.
Deletei think some repositioning might do it some good. move the wings back maybe. the ascetic isnt too terrible, my problem is that it looks as aerodynamic as a stone.
ReplyDeleteThey didn't get here from the Fantasy direction. It really is from the Hell Blade that has been possessed/mutated by Chaos. If you look at the two side-by-side you can see the natural progression. I really hope that they will make the Hell Blade (and Hell Talon) available in plastic sprues with flier bases in the near future, potentially through a White Dwarf style update (like the Storm Talon).
ReplyDeleteThe dragon motif has been on the vehicle accessory sprue since at least 4th. I (and I'm certain many, many others) have used those dragon heads to replace the tips of lascannons and heavy bolters. It's really not that far off of a direction to go with a new model range.
Look wise i thinks it's very abitious. I like it. Especially the pic with the green energy. Looks very Necron like :D
ReplyDeleteI really don't like this kit.maybe it's the lack of a tail I'm not sure.from what I have seen of the rules I loved how is played....so I ordered a hell talon from forge world to count as
ReplyDelete-"High elf lord on dragon" head?
ReplyDelete-Hellblade wings as wings?
-It's got a huge Ahole in the back.
-60pound for robot chicken.
Result: Fail-Release
This model reminds me of the Ork Stompa a fail in both priced and style. There are those times when even good artist fail.
ReplyDeleteWhat was wrong with the ork stompa? Was it just that every dedicated ork player builds their own?
DeleteI don't own one (I built my own xD) but I didn't think it looked bad!
I honestly can't understand the hate towards this model, it's filled with about as much win as GW has ever managed to create in a model. It's truly amazing!
ReplyDeleteAgree I'm with you
Deleteexcept for the big gaping massive shitter at the back... Look at the 3D on GW site...
DeleteAs a chaos player, I am happy with every model. I am tired of looking at the current models, and was awaiting something new and interesting for a long time. The fact that we get models with so much DETAIL is enough to make me very happy with the Heldrake as well as all the other models.
DeleteAlthough I admit the Maulers were a bit of a cop out, but things like the Mauler/Forgefiend and Warpsmith more than make up for it in my opinion.
Beggars can't be choosers!
Beggars can't be choosers? Lol, we are paying top dollar. Hardly "beggars". I know I will choose not to buy any of the new models, especially this one. The whole line is a disappointment.
Deleteif you don't like the main exhaust port at the rear end I think you could use it to add a longer tail and crop the current tail or suspend the additional tail from it.
DeleteI hope there's more to it rules wise. At 170 points its not worth it from what stats we've seen. Ill stick to my allied necron detachment with doom scythe.
ReplyDeleteLet's compare stat lines, shall we?
DeleteNec DS: 11/11/11 BS4
SR's: Living Metal
no vector strike, but 1 S10 shot, 4 S7 shots.
so, 5. (May only shoot at one model, obviously)
CSM HD: 12/12/10 BS3
SR's: It Will Not Die, 5++
S7 vector strike, 4 S8 shots OR 1 AP3 inferno cannon, so (D3+1) + 4 shots against 2 flyers, or (D3+1) + 1 shots against 1 flyer and 1 unit of infantry.
The HD auto-hits with the VS attacks, thereby skipping a crucial step the DS must take. On average, the DS will hit with 3 out of its 5 shots and will get one glance or pen on the HD. Conversely, the HD WILL get AT LEAST one glance, but most likely two with a lucky pen thrown in there occasionally. It will then proceed to shoot ANOTHER DS with its hades cannon, hitting twice and glancing on a 3+ for those. This thing has the potential, although its obviously not a guarantee, to kill two flyers a turn (or kill a flyer and decimate an entire squad of MEQ in one turn with the bale flamer).
And after all that, when the last Doom Scythe finally gets a chance to shoot back, he's going to have a hell of a time getting past all those nifty special rules.
AND ITS CHEAPER THAN THE DOOM SCYTHE
So, go ahead and take your doom scythe. I'll be taking two Heldrakes and laughing the whole time......
You my friend... have a very good point....
DeleteNot to mention the fact that Doom Scythes can't hit fliers with their Death Ray (thanks FAQ).
DeleteIn a straight up fight, I'd back the Helldrake too!
1 dragon or 9 scythes? :)
DeleteFirst off, the doom scythe is only 5 points more. Secondly, the tesla destructor is twin linked, gives you 2 additional hits on 6's, and is balistic 4. Hades cannon, 4 s8 shots at bs 3 and a vectorstrike instead of death ray. I've had no problem taking out gk storm ravens armor 12 with a 100 point night scythe. You go ahead and field your hd. Ill tesla glance you to death long before you roll your it will not die, and I will be laughing the whole time! Especially knowing I paid $30 less for my flyer!
DeleteYeah... IMHO the real-world price tag makes the most difference... 75$ is just rude.
DeleteGK storm ravens also don't have a 5++ and regenerate lost HP's. Your 4 twin-linked shots will, on average, give you 4 hits (with your added in little extra hits on sixes added in, BTW), of which 2 will pen or glance, one of which will be denied by the heldrake's 5++. I'm not too worried about it. I will gladly take those chances. The rules are very, very decent, although NOT op, by any means.
DeleteSo are land raiders. It's an extremely high price hobby all the way around. If it's so expensive to you, buy it on ebay after like, three months at 20% off.
An AP3 torrenting flamer is exactly what the Burna Bomber should have had. Even if it was 1 or 2 per game.
ReplyDeleteMore anti light infantry blasts is not what Orks need.
Total missed opportunity there.
At least we still got the (right) choice of the dakkajet! Was really hoping the dragon would have a similar level of customisation that the ork jets got. Best games-workshop kit in my opinion.
DeleteI don't like it, I just don't like the whole Idea of a dragon in wh40k. Sort of reminds me of a fly chicken. I rather get a storm hawk(?gw) the space marine version. and proxy it. It just looks more like its for wh then wh40k....
ReplyDeleteYes, because obviously super high tech ancient Egyptians, and genetically superhuman beings who may turn into werewolves are definitely something that fits into the sci-fi verse of 40k perfectly.
DeleteSeriously, wasn't it only a few years back that people were complaining that only Warhammer had Chaos Dragons and 40k didn't have an equivalent? Now people are complaining that this model is a dragon and it doesn't fit in with the rest of 40k. Isn't it just wonderful to be immersed in such a hypocritical fandom?
it was one person's opinion db..
Deleteyou sir, are a legend. Best reply ever. I am applauding this heartily.
Delete40k is NOT science fiction, it is fantasy.that's why all the mad bollocks that we love happens without batting an eye.It doesn't need an explanation. If players don't want a dragon, don't get it. I play night lords and won't be using it but I will be mounting a chaos dwarf on it to use in fantasy. I do however think it rocks. If chaos got a jet fighter all the miserable dweebs out there would bemoan the lack of inspiration and that they were just spikey marines. What you have is a DRAGON!! the most individual looking flyer since necrons could fly croissants.Don't hate, just appreciate that you have the opportunity to use such a diverse range of bitching models.
The defence rests
Fanboys will crucify you for any negative opinion, man :-) I love this "logic": "If you dont like it dont play it"
DeleteI'd say that's pretty good logic, Wenceslas. GW wants your MONEY. So if you don't buy their product, they will change it in order to increase sales. In other words, "If you don't like it, don't play it" means you are exercising your power as a consumer with what you do and do not purchase. That's the best damn logic I've ever heard. Kinda like voting, but with your wallet.
DeleteGive ugly model vector strike, and people will buy it. Many will even convicte themself its actually nice model. If any model/fantasy game company follow ONLY profit as you wrote, it devalue it - and "voting" doesnt helps here, as powerfull rules sells any garbage.
DeleteDaemon Princes can vector strike for around the same price, with just as much resilience (with MoZ). Take that instead if you hate the model so much. Powerful rules don't sell garbage. They sell stat lines. Garbage-looking models don't sell. Period. The Heldrake has a very good balance and yet, from what I'm hearing you say, you will not be buying one. In fact, from what I've been reading on this site, there are all kinds of folks who hate this model. Those are sales GW just missed out on. If enough people do that, they will rework the model.
DeleteLol, although it may take 15 years...... Sorry, Sisters of Battle!
Okay First off I cant Believe you guys are taking this Sh't as a good release, the whole Chaos Release looks like junk except for a few models and the Starter set.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 1 where are mt re scalps on Typhus Abba don etc these Hq are supposed to be much bigger than average space marines
question2 All were getting are a few upgrade sprews and that's it and on top of that Gw you want to charge us so much money . Naftka you need to do a topic on what went wrong and why are nt we getting the same love as Dark Eldar or Blood Angels or Necrons did .
Answer 1: They won't do a re-sculpt just because you believe they aren't in scale. These are miniatures, not being in scale is kind of their thing. They will only make a re-sculpt of a model if they see it doesn't match with the look of the current range of models; which obviously hasn't happened yet.
DeleteAnswer 2: If you followed the rumor mill more closely there were a variety of one saying model expansions; so this may not be the only thing we're getting. And nice job assuming everyone else shares you opinion of "Why did GW give those army great stuff and not us, HERESY!!!".
Oh, and also work on your spelling/grammar, it was hard to read your complaints. You're using a keyboard, at least spend more than 20 seconds typing so people can actually read your opinion.
Deletedark eldar and necrons required complete redesigns because their books were too simplistic & had too few options to make a reasonable army in the 2000's. Also, the old models were balls & nobody would buy them (i have a tonne of donated 3rd ed dark eldar.... aweful, aweful sculpts). Blood Angels got what? a single new tank, a single new dreadnought, two new plastic kits and a couple of new characters. They did NOT get new sculpts for ANY of their old characters. What are you smoking that you feel the new chaos book doesn't hold up to those new standards? The current chaos character sculpts are fine and don't require updating yet. they are compatible with both the old range and the new releases - Huron & Fabius are the only two that are starting to look a bit dated and they still look great compared to the space marine lines.
Delete^ This. What I don't understand, was that a week or so ago everyone was "OMG Chaos! CHAOS! For the Dark Gods!!!" at this release. Now, everyone seems to be rather negative of this release. I remember reading an article (Can't remember the blog) that basically said there will never be a chaos codex like 3.5 edition ever again and that people should not have unrealistically high expectations of a release - "Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment". The designers have hit a gem here with distinguishing between the 10k old warp-addled chaos marines and the whole 'spiky marines' look. I don't play Chaos, but the new release makes it look fun/challenging to play against.
Delete@The Anon at 2:45...
DeleteYou think Huron looks dated? He is the most recent character sculpt we have. He's from 2006/7 (Whenever the 4th edition book was released). Abaddon, Kharn, Ahriman, Fabius, Cypher, and Doomrider all are dated. I still think most of these models are great, but they would all benefit from a new sculpt as they are from early 3rd edition (circa 1998/9?).
They will all be redone in time. It has been stated numerously that GW wants to have models for every entry in the book. We will see resculpts in wave 2 or 3.
Personally, I would like to see a power armoured plastic commander kit like the Space Marines have and plastic upgrade kits for all the daemonic steeds.
I didn't think Doomrider was still even on the GW site? The model absolutley still fit with the new additions to the line - there no way we'll see resculpts of any in the near future. And by the way, anyone notice how old Mephiston is?
DeleteGW policy:
Deleteminimum work and attention:maximum prices.
i agree that almost whole new chaos sucks:
-warpsmith? model looks almost like loyalist one. if you paint em the same they probably look identical
-dragon? damn trans robo dino pigtail shi*!
-maulerfiend looks decent
-forgefiend? butchercannoned looks kinda lamy but with 3 ectoplasmas is a total failure
-champions and sorc? are they high or what? 20$???
-raptors are cool, warps are averate
dark vengance: all cool exept average cultists.
-upgreade packs?? cmon, we need something like black templars have, for all legions. not that reheated junk GW give us.
iam just sad and dissapionted.. i need to get decimator. once i though its average, but with new releases in mind it shines like a sun!
ohhh i almost forgot..
DeleteBIGGEST FAILURE OF ALL, i present u:
mutilitators- thats really nice pile os crap. reheated in microwave.. they could do everything and anything. but we have THIS.
sweet mother of mercy!
Thanks Jan for the support to my post I appreciate it and totally agree with u on the obliterator/pile of don't know where these mutilators came from, maybe there toilet. Any how I wont be buying anything if this second wave is horrible looking.they should wake up and see we support them, they only provide a product which we may or may not buy, and yes the old HQ s need a re work..
DeleteYou do know that People visit GW Site?
ReplyDeleteI just feel really let down was really hoping for new sculps and a whole new release like Dark Eldar got. not meaning to offend anyone just really down .
DeleteI hear Ya brother, but the dark eldar needed it more then anyone imo
DeleteSo my plan has been to take one of these and trim its neck size down to just a stub. Then replace the head with the small eyed toothy head from the forgefiend model but add some big pointed ears to that badboy.
ReplyDeleteInstant flying death Bat for my Night Lords Army.
Go back and look at the to down shots of the dragon, cover its head and neck with your finger and tell me your not looking at a bats body.
dude, put the head off a terrorgheist on it.
Deletebest thing is you can still build the zombie dragon.
hmmm $14 from a bits website... looks pretty awesome... and the way the mouth is positioned I can still fit a gun in its maw. SOLD!
Deleteglad i could help dude!
DeleteBefore i start defending this thing, let me just say that im gonna go mauler feind, just so i can get the potential 8 str 8+ attacks on the charge(yes it can can rack up 8 hits on the charge). I don't think this models is ment to shine due to its weaponry as much as it supposed to be amazing because it is hard to kill. As a flyer with 12 armor front and back, only dedicated anti air units will be able to bring it down. Also, if this unit has the daemon rule, and it will not die, this creature quickly becomes a bigger pain to bring down. This quickly turns it into a damage soaking annoyance unit. still, im not gonna use it, because its a flyer, and i hate using reserves.
ReplyDeleteLooks more like a flying snapping turtle than a dragon. T-U-R-T-L-E POWER!
ReplyDeleteI will field this model all the time. And every time it comes into play, I will play the Green Ranger's flute dagger.
ReplyDeleteit has alot of gas
ReplyDeleteI can't wait to put aside 74 dollars to do some conversion to this thing, deploy this in front of my chaos marines in a game and say "Predacons, TERRORIZE!"
ReplyDeleteThis. Terrasaur, Terrorize!
DeleteLooking at it from the rear - scale it up, take the design back towards mechanical, loyalist style, and it is how I imagine the crusade era Stormbirds should look like.
ReplyDeleteOnly thing I can't stand for this guy is the stumpy legs. Imagine that thing trying to walk. I don't care if it never lands, just imagine it walking on his little legs.
ReplyDeleteNow the legs make more sense to me, mutated "hydrolic" landing pegs. Also I really like the sculpt, the rear exhost port is a little to big I feel, but overall I really like it. Also I manny of the people dislike the model probably never liked the idea of it and has nothing to do with its look. As for the Mauler/Forge Fiend, possible my favorite models from release. The new dragon/ dinosaur/ reptilian feel of the chaos models kinda feels like th right direction to move for me, Chaos Obviously would move on from straight technology after a while and the giant monster-lizard-robot thing does feel very evil.
DeleteI like the new models too, but I find most of the "big guys" suffer from bad standard poses.
DeleteThe Maulerfiend is supposed to be an unstoppable force, a beast that rips tanks in half with it's claws, and the model is good, but it's pose is everything but menacing.
The paintjob doesn't help either. Black Legion isn't really a color scheme that makes models stand out from the rest, and the Iron Warriors one is too shiny for something so big.
From pictures, I wasn't keen on the stumpy legs. Having seen it in person (gamesday uk) those legs don't look so bad. You can't judge it properly, even from 360 pictures. See it in person and judge it properly. Then you can dislike it xD
DeleteMost heavily armed unit in the game??? Maybe on a point for power basis, but I would argue that the armament on EITHER Dark Eldar flier outstrip the Heldrake.....
ReplyDeleteOn GW web it even says the heldrake ISNT very well armed.
DeleteIt's got decent armament. 4 S8 shots or a S6 AP3 super template is pretty awesome, especially with the added S7 vector strike. No DE flyer has that. But like the GW article said, this thing is meant to survive the entire game and be unbelievably annoying.
DeleteThey still could have attempted to make it better than a Vendetta at anti air.
DeleteWhy? The vendetta was supposed to be a dedicated anti-tank unit. Says so right in the fluff. Of course, now it's some kind of ungodly AA unit, which is kinda ridiculous, but a vendetta vs a heldrake is actually a pretty even fight, if you think about it.
Deleteheldrake fires four times, hits with two, glances or pens once. Most likely a pen and a nothing, in all honesty. At least that's how I usually roll with those kinds of odds. Roll on the damage chart, take a lascannon, let's say. Pretty good odds, honestly, since the most commonly rolled number on a D6 is a 3 or 4. So, the vendetta fires back with 2 lascannons now, hitting with both and getting a pen and a glance. Heldrake saves one, the glance. So, let's say he rolls a 4, too, taking your autocannon. Next turn, you vector strike him, bam, he's gone or has one hull point left. Honestly that could go either way, simply because of the heldrake's superior resilience offered by his awesome special rules, which the vendetta most definitely does not have. at least give it a chance before you write it off, I'd say.
Looks like a flying chicken IMO
ReplyDeleteI just figured out why it looks so bad. It's got no freaking tail! It's all truncated and offends my sense of symmetry! Should be an easy fix - anyone got suggestions on what could be used to add a tail to the heldork to make it look better?
ReplyDeleteSymmetry? You do know what chaos is, right?
DeleteBest bet is mix the kit with zombie dragon bits, it's already trying to have a distressed flesh/bony feel
DeleteZab remove the neck use as tail, put the two back wings diagonally from the end. Voila
ReplyDeleteThanks, that'll do it! A drake with no tail, chaos is silly.
Deletefound some new pics of the codex if anyone is interested (well they were new to me) http://apocalypse40k.blogspot.com.au/2012/09/chaos-space-marine-codex-photos.html
ReplyDeleteNice! Thanks!
DeleteWith all the love/hate this model is getting, I would have sworn it was running for President. I wanna see it and the fiends on the table before I pass judgement.
ReplyDeleteI'd have to agree with some previous comments. I was impressed with it's performance in the WD battle report....
ReplyDeleteBut I can't help but think when looking at the Helldrake's rear view....
DE-FEATHERED CHICKEN.
Give it a a tail or something! But no...they went with Ferocious front angle,
chickeny cluck cluck rear angle.
GO HELLCLUCK!!
A flying Mecha dragon is just plain silly. Chaos deserves cool corrupted fighters with pitted wings, worn out demon engines, and possessed pilots, not Mecha-king Ghiddorah. Apologies to all you who love the thing, but I think it's just ridiculous.
ReplyDeletehigh five!
DeleteLol... yeah, honestly this looks like something I'd have bought when I was 9.
DeleteAm I the only one that has looked at this thing and then looked at the zombie dragon kit and got crazy conversion ideas? Personally, I'm all for new Chaos stuff (especially an up to date codex)... my boys have been fighting an uphill battle for a good many years now.
ReplyDeleteFact: people who are negative all the time on average live much shorter lives then those who think positive sometimes up to a staggering 20 years. Fact the internet is going through a negative craze and thinks its fashionable and as a result alot of people will be living shortlive. Ok joking aside people really need to chill and actually wait till they have the products in hand before slamming them. I for one think the Dragon is a cool concept and if you dont like it just convert a stormraven and move on.
ReplyDeleteThe reason this chaos release hasn't got the same attention as necrons, grey knights or dark eldar is because those 3 codexs were ancient outdated and had little variety. They needed huge overhuals in models, competiveness and lore to become relavent again and I tell you it took years of work on those 3. Chaos does not need this. They already have an established range and lore needing only a new codex to fix them. The Necron, Grey knight and Dark Eldar reboot treatments wont happen again for alongtime and outside sisters of battle there no other armies that really need such treatment anymore.
People need to get off there high horse's, learn some facts and lower there unrealistic expectations. Its just a game were you paint your figures, there are more important things in the world to get angry at and if you cant accept this maybe you shouldn't be playing warhammer 40k. Theres plently of variety outthere and nobody is making you buy the new figures
I think Tau and Eldar could use a reboot. Especially Tau. Much potential there.
DeleteOptimus Prime called. He wants his d**k back.
ReplyDeleteThis just in: Optimus Prime's d**k was just seen flying over a unit of marines spitting (-_0) flames. It looks bad. Really, really bad.
DeleteTalk about a burning sensation when ya pee. Geez us
the Heldrake may look more like a chicken than a dragon but at least it doesnt look like a croisant like some fliers... I plan to use a Helblade from forgeworld... think of the vector stike as a strafing run of sorts...
ReplyDeleteReposting from the Games Workshop sight? This place worse than BoLS at recyling...
ReplyDeleteThen don't read it and go away.....
DeleteI just hate the forward swept wings. I want desperately to be able to put them on the other way, but I don't have high hopes.
ReplyDeleteA warp fire dragon or something maybe.
Natfka posts stuff like this alongside all other info he posts, and considering the massive number of posts on this topic it seems like putting it up for discussion was a good idea
ReplyDeleteI haven't read the other posts yet but this "dragon" looks like a faint flying metal turkey with a dragon ish looking head. Look at how stubby the legs are! I'm sorry but this model is ugly. If I ever buy this overpriced model than I will have a ton of converting to do.
ReplyDeletethere's no reason to be so extremely negative about it, expressing your opinion can be couched in much less absolute terms. Here's what I mean, lets take your post and re-write it to still be an expression of your disdain without sounding like an indictment of the hobby in general:
Delete"I haven't read the other posts yet but this dragon thing looks silly to me. I think it kinda looks like a flying metal turkey with a dragon head. I personally dislike it and think it's ugly. If I ever bought this model I would need to convert it quite a bit to fit with my own style"
Leaving out words that are all about attacking GW like "Overpriced" and writing it from a personal position instead of as a statement of fact means you are not denying the possibility of it being an amazing and cool looking kit to others.
Nicely put, Anon 12:44. And it definitely needs to be said.
DeleteI'm also not a huge fan of certain aspects of the model, but I see potential and can't wait to convert it for my DG!
If you take a look through this post, other posts and dare I say forums, almost everyone seems really negative bordering on pure unjustifiable rage about this release. The punchline? This release hasn't happened yet. I welcome the new chaos stuff (recently taken up space wolves to fill that void in my soul called 'Eldar' until their release) as I think it will be exciting to play against. Chaos has gotten half a reboot: We now have 10k warp-addled evil guys as opposed to Marines: spiky edition. Everyone just shed some electrons and be positive, kay?
DeleteIf you're on minimum wage with a family to suport the pricing is an issue that you probably want to share with others...
DeletePosts like yours were u just whinge about what some1 else writes and correct them are even more irritating to read than negative comments...at least people who post negative stuff are staying on topic and talking about the models not smuggly telling people how to express themselves
Delete@ Anon 1:58- Are you referring to me? If so, I apologise if I came across as 'whinging' but I wrote my comment feeling a tad frustrated/exasperated and sad, as everything has yet to be released and everyone seems to be in 'rage mode'. Price has been, is now and always shall be an issue, especially in Oz. There are alternatives to GW retail price- ebay, independent retailers and so on. If you think a model is ugly, just convert something using other model parts -ie: a nurgle heldrake could be made using the vampire counts zombie dragon as a base with the river troll vomit piece to model baleflame. Posted in a neutral, non-smug, non-condescending mood.
DeleteMate i was in the exact same mood when i posted that lol i also apologise personaly dont mind the model just think its a shade expensive for what it is...posted in a non-angry mood ;)
DeleteAh no sorry warlock was aimed at the anon at the top of the thread not you
Delete@ Both anons
DeleteIt's cool.
Hahaha dudes chill! When I posted the original dont like the look comment above that is just my opinion. TONs of unhappy comments are posted on here all the time! I dont see why "correction" or anger are appropriate to talking about how someone doesnt like the look of a PLASTIC MODEL that im sure many other people will like and enjoy. I said it looked like a giant turkey cause to me it does! no correction necessary, I didnt hurt the hobby, and life will go on! Love the blog and you guys that comment cause your as geeky as me :) so dont sweat it!
DeleteI like it. It actually looks just like a Hellblade that has warped into a beast. Good kit. I hated the idea of a "dragon" when I first heard about it, but now I've seen it, I'm really looking forward to adding one to my Death Guard.
ReplyDeleteCool kit with some conversion to extend the tail (and my friend had a good point that the wings were a little too Aquila like, cannot unsee), but it doesn't really fit into a Night Lords army. And given that it costs £45 the Hellblade starts to look like a very attractive option, even if it lacks the sexy special rules.
ReplyDelete'Waahh, Vector Strike only S7'
ReplyDelete'Waaah, weak rules for 170 points'
Please insert my Harpy in your rectum.
Oh, and FMC's only hit side armour with Vector Strike,
Well considering nids are an old dex at this point, and were written by possibly the worst writer that GW has, it's hardly fair to compare the two dexes.
DeleteNot sure I want one. It's a bit of a glass cannon by the sounds of things. I think you'll be lucky to make the points back before it's destroyed. And if it's your only thing to combat flyers, you may find yourself in trouble if it gets shot down early.
ReplyDeleteDefinitely not a glass cannon. AV 12/12/10, It Will Not Die and a 5++ do not make for a very 'glass' cannon. That thing is going to stick around for a while, especially with only dedicated AA units being able to even hurt it; consistently, that is.
DeleteI'm betting this puppy will be around for pretty much the whole game, running around making your opponent's life miserable. Which, I think, is what Phil had in mind when he made the rules.
Just been reflecting on the info in White Dwarf (Jes Goodwin WD p147) about the origins of the Heldrake. Taking a look at the Hell Blade and Hell Talon models over on Forge World you can see why they have gone for the sharp wings swept forward, and the Hell Blade does have a pretty large exhaust port at the rear end.
ReplyDeleteIt would seem that everyone has missed that you can fit 3 of these, 2 flying daemon princes, a bloodthirster and a chaos daemon daemon prince into 1500 points if you are minimalist with your troops choices. Now it probably wont be that competitive against a necron flier list or in objective missions (i.e. most of them) but it might just be worth it for the look on your opponents face when you're unpacking it :P
ReplyDeleteYou mean when he sees you are a cheesy power gaming douche who's about to waste 3 hours of his life not having fun at a game he has no chance of winning? Is that the look you are talking about? People like you drive me nuts. My 10yo niece could take a list like that and be dominant. Having a list that takes advantage of the rules doesn't make you a good player or tactician.
DeleteThat said I also think the model sux. But I wont b buying 1 so no skin off my back.