The Dark Angel "Tempest" is a new speeder that can "zoom" with dual twin-linked assault cannons and a typhoon launcher. Not only that, but Asmodai is back, and a lot more.......


Yesterday we had a set of rumors that were translated from Italian. While some of it was hard to read because of the translation, we were gifted with the corrections to these rumors. According to our source, some of it was wrong, off, or even backwards. So take a look,

Please remember that these are rumors.

via Faeit 212 (a Must Remain Anonymous Source)

... The DA codex will have a new choice in bipode heavy media mortis to be appointed and will have two guns.
It's just the Dreadnought.  DA Dreadnoughts can purchase an offhand autocannon or missile launcher as normal, upgrade their primary gun as normal, or replace both arms with a pair of matching guns to be deemed "Mortis."

there will be a new character that ought to choose allies from other codex (called guard?) as a troop choice ...
This is backwards, one character prevents you from taking allies from Guard.

about the Deathwing I heard something about a box containing two hammers and shield and weapon type weapon nemesis that should give FNP to 2 +
The apothecary is FNP 5+ like normal, only one unit per army, there is a similar-to-warding staff option but not as good and for librarians as it uses a warp charge but is an automatic psychic power that can be shut down only by runic weapons and the like.

there will be new variants of land speeder ... (And perhaps also one that makes the functions of the storm talon)
Correct, the Tempest basically.  It's can Zoom, comes with a twin-linked assault cannon (not on a turret) and typhoon launcher.

the "Blazing Sword" is something that has to do with the ravenwing ....
No idea what he's talking about.

The presence of 3 banners that will characterize the army and the command team. 
Replacement for the distributed per-squad banners.  These are a lot like the SM special characters, they grant a USR for the whole army when purchased and are very expensive, must be modeled (but come as raised image banners in the DA character box) and still apply even if the banner is lost.  It's just a visual representation of a way to place points.

Note: This is also the current direction for the next SM release, where Combat Tactics is renamed Chapter Tactics and is replaced by paying a surcharge on your HQ, instead of having to buy specific characters.
Named characters still impose their Chapter Tactics as per normal, and are cheaper than a standard HQ + ChapterTax, but it's a nice alternative.

the DA will have different rules on the use of plasma weapons .. something warming ... to represent the fact that they are experts in using these weapons.
They can reroll failed armor saves against Gets Hot! and vehicles get to reroll its 4+ to avoid the hull point.

New aircraft is introduced into the codex DA will not be the storm Talon.
That would be the tempest from above

the cyclone missile launcher will have an AA if the model remains stationary for that turn.
Close but no cigar.  Remaining stationary lets you reroll misses with Cyclone launchers against flyers.

There will be new options for the predator.
Plasma Destroyer Turret, heavy 3 plasma cannon, no plasma cannon sponsons.

WW AA will have the option as an upgrade and 3 different types of missile to choose before the game.
Replace both Castellan and Vengeance with Helios Missile launcher for free.  Heavy 1, Twin Linked, Skyfire Interceptor.

special character chaplain will be introduced
He's not new, it's Asmodai.  He's just making a come back.

there will be new psychic powers and will be given space to a couple of new units that are not present in the previous codex.
The first part is true, they get a new Lore with only some resemblance to the current codex.  There are 2 new units (outside of the additions of Vanguard and Sternguard).

There are two basic troops choices and not just one.
Tactical Squad and Deathwing are troops.

it comes to AA missile launchers in the new codex .. I do not know, and this refers to the type of the missile destroyers or to those mentioned above.
Devastators can upgrade to take flakk missiles at +5 points per model, replaces Krak and Frag options.


89 Comments:

  1. Couldn't believe that Mortis-Dread thing... but who knows?

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  2. "REPLACES Krak and Frag options"

    That seems like a really poor option then - Flakk missiles might not save the game after all.

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    Replies
    1. Seems a bit much to replace both AND pay for them too! I'd have though replacing frag OR krak for a couple of points would be reasonable.

      Thing is they don't want everyone to suddenly have flakk missiles because flyers would then be a waste of time. Makes sense that you have to sacrifice anti-infantry/anti-tank to get anti-air weaponry.

      Delete
    2. If they were AP2 or Strength 8 I could dig it but I just can't see str 7 being worth the Skyfire tax AND the utility of the Missile Launcher.

      Another DOA unit entry it seems.

      Delete
    3. Notice 'per model'. This means you'll replace one, perhaps two models with flakk. S7 is plenty against flyers as most of them are only AV11 or 12, and you will get plenty of rear-shots as well since they will zoom around.

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    4. If you could give them all three variants they'd become auto include models, something they're trying to move away from.

      Strength 7 is more than enough to down fliers, which contrary to the net haven't broken the game, and the tempest sounds like a decent interceptor. I don't see the issue.

      Delete
    5. There was an iteration of playtest where you replaced only krak with flakk and was free. because there is no modelling difference, players could (without adjusting their list) swap to flakk when they saw / suspected lots of flyers.

      In the end it was simplified to being an outright replacement of both for all missiles in the squad, at a cost to avoid the above. Either it's Flakk or it's Standard.

      Flakk have also (as a whole) been reduced in effectiveness as they were Imperium only, and the GW designer involvement wanted to steer away from the Imperium having all the tricks.

      If you want to take out flyers, you need to either run flyers yourself or dedicated units / vehicles that are ground to air.

      This levels the playing field for all races who will each get at least 1 flyer, and 1 ground to air unit that can semi-function ground to ground.

      Infantry just don't do that well against Flyers.

      I think guard will get more use out of Flakk than Marines.

      The Tempest which can come in squadrons and is cheaper than a storm talon though less versatile do an excellent job at shooting down Night/Doom Scythes.

      Sorry no Storm Talon or Storm Raven for DA.

      And the Helios' interceptor rule makes it really solid, since unlike the Hydra it can still shoot at light armor in the event that there's no flyers (or shoot light armor, then again in the enemy's movement phase).

      Also, it can be taken as 1-3 vehicle squadron for 1 Heavy Support.

      Delete
    6. Just to confirm, is it exactly the same rules as the Forge World Land Speeder Tempest?

      Because under those rules, it's a speeder which has the option to convert to a flyer for a turn, although when it does so it cannot shoot any of its weapons. They're not particularly good against other flyers.

      Delete
    7. What universe are you guys playing in where a handful of Str 7 AP 'meh' shots are "more than enough" to deal with flyers? I play Elysians and I can tell you guys that's not even close to true unless you roll 6's like a pro.

      Not to mention the flyers shoot first.

      Also we're talking about investing points in a unit (Devs) that aren't cheap and, most of the time, aren't scoring. I just don't see Flakk missiles making an impact.

      Perhaps they're only part of the picture? Maybe there's more AA out there we don't know about? Maybe GW learned their lesson and we won't have anymore Nightscythe/Vendetta hiccups (all the other flyers are pretty reasonable)?

      Delete
    8. I've downed plenty of necron flyers using Ork Lootas. They have Deffguns which are strength 7. Granted they get volume of shots but that's more a counter of needing 6's (rather than 5's :P) to hit! Reliably hitting fliers is a big deal so reliable strength 7 (could) be enough to deal with fliers

      Delete
  3. Asmodai is still listed on GW's website. stats and all so is that new or did he never go away?

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    Replies
    1. He never went away on the site.

      Delete
    2. I think it's just a comeback in the ass-kicking sense, as in the entire Codex making a comeback!

      Delete
    3. Aun'shi is also still listed on GW website but not the right stats so I hope he makes a comeback

      Delete
  4. So CSM next? :O
    :D
    Cant wait

    ReplyDelete
  5. Need my rumor fix! Super excited for DA!

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    Replies
    1. My thoughts exactly my friend!

      Delete
  6. When it comes down to new rules, I am highly sceptical about any rumor... well, we'll have to wait and see, of course, but frankly I wouldn't be surprised if all of this were just wishlisting...

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  7. At the bottom he says that there are two new units that are not van/sternguard. Would these two new units be Asmodai and the new tempest flyer then or something else entirely?

    If the only completely new things are Asmodai and the flyer I'll be severely underwhelmed.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. By units I would assume he means units as in squad etc. not necessarily codex entries.

      Delete
  8. Just a question, Asmodai will get a new mini or wil it be the same, with the wrong equipment?

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  9. I did say I liked, but now I'm a little jaded. The Labs Speeder tempest is already available to us as it's an FW model and the Helios whirlwindnd sounds identical to the GW Hyperios variant. So now I'm suspicious...

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    Replies
    1. Labs speeder? Damn you fat thumbs!

      Delete
    2. Yes it's a beautiful model. It was in the latest Aeronautica book, coincidentally painted in Ravenwing colours. It has a single assault cannon and a typhoon launcher.

      Delete
    3. It's no different than the Vendetta/Valkyrie or the Hydra for Imperial Guard.

      It's also plastic, which makes it more available.

      (For the Hyperios whirlwind it's just a different set of warheads you can glue or magnet in).

      Beyond that there are still two new, unique units which are very cool

      Delete
  10. I think (hope) that the new land speeder is a ravewing entry which to me is fluffy. I hope we still get access to the storm talon or storm raven. I'm intrigued by the character that denies us assess to guard. He should have a badass bonus.

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    Replies
    1. I'd have to agree in your hopes for use of storm talon. I bought one under the impression that it was available to all SM armies. if DA can't use'em there goes $50 >.<

      Delete
    2. just an absolute guess but could the imp denying character be cypher, it always is a bit vague about his connection to the chapter, and siding with chaos sounds soooo DA (breaking all the rules to get the job done ect) also would give a good fluffy reason to avoid imp witnesses. Though again this is plain supposition

      Delete
  11. Land Speeder Tempest?? Wasn't that in Dawn of War Soulstorm?

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    Replies
    1. It was, it's also available from Forgeworld for all SM codices

      Delete
  12. Funny how so many DA rumors come about the moment people suspect them to be closer to release...but nothing on Chaos recently. Hmmm

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    Replies
    1. And I mean "leaks" almost or some nig rumors. Not sure though but Natfka always has a trick up his sleeve....

      Delete
    2. Because I already did a several hour QnA on Chaos. There's not much less to rumor except to type out the entire codex word for word and be hunted like a dog across every plane of existence.

      Delete
    3. And how do I know this was you? Could be any anon...

      Delete
    4. You don't really. You should be able to tell by my writing style. I often say "However, ... , however." etc in the same sentence for example.

      Delete
    5. Nope. Your 90% likely to be a troll...

      Delete
    6. He's probably trolling. However he's right about that fact that Chaos has been rumoured to death. There's not much more left to discuss.

      Delete
    7. Hopefully JayDee is successful in driving off all the Anons and their scandalous rumors.

      Delete
    8. I AM THE ANONYMOUS SOURCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Delete
  13. "There are two basic troops choices and not just one. Tactical Squad and Deathwing are troops."

    So does this mean Belial is gone? And are we going to see DA be like GK in that they will get a supa termie unit and regular ones?????

    This is awesome if so - as I will likely be bringing Asmodai and use the Starter box Termies as the uber unit. Maybe the second unit is the watchers we can take as jump infantry :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Belial is still in, he just isn't needed as a tax to run Deathwing as troops and has seen some point cost adjustments (he's still more expensive than current, but also slightly better).

      There is no elite deathwing veterans that are better than the troop ones.

      The watchers in the dark are not a unit, but expanded a little more in the fluff.

      Delete
  14. any chance that they are still geting ravenwing jet bike rember hearing a rumor a while back

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  15. The character that restricts allies is interesting. I imagine that we'll see more of that in various releases - characters restricting allies or changing the ally level - from AoC to Battle Brothers or vice versa, etc.

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  16. Still hoping like hell for the LR Ares and jet bikes, really just want an Ares badly.

    Astalen (@work)

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    Replies
    1. These are on my list as hoping as well for this codex.

      Delete
    2. Jetbikes?

      Have I missed something?

      Only one I know about is Sammael's. If there were jetbikes, as in more than 1, I'd be more tempted to collect the robed ones.

      Jetbikes?

      Delete
    3. Jetbikes Could fit in Vanilla dex aswell.
      Jetbikes are silly... Who would by Bikes then?
      Eldar got jetbikes instead of Bikes
      So you hear eldar Players Fällung for Bikes???
      It doesnt fit SM IMO just silly
      Only fit into preheresy Army

      Delete
    4. Perhaps they're the Dark Angels answer to 'Sanguinary Guard' or an honor guard for Sammael. Not a replacement for bikes.

      Delete
    5. They should rather make a guard for the chaptermaster Azrael. Not the 2nd Company Master. GW changed sammaels rules from Bike to Speeder to jetbike over the years. Why would they Stick to smth thats only 8 years Old? I dont get the Hype for jetbikes. Sammael on jetbike is Not Even Good in Game & the Model Looks silly.

      And if GW will make jetbikes They will be slightly better than Bikes in Order to sell. So Nobody will BuY RW Bikes. Thus RW Army worthless!

      So youre just asking to be forced to BuY a Model that does Kind of the Same Thing but Looks different and will prob be more expensive....just so you can REPLACE youre Old RW army for a New RW Army?
      Sry i rather build a Big Army than replace Parts of it. And i rather See some imagination and Not rehashing of Old stuff.

      Delete
    6. Ha! I've no Dark Angel army of any sort. Never had, don't know yet if I will.

      As for being forced: it's my money and I'll buy what I want.

      I've got free will, and the will to use it.

      Delete
    7. Jet bikes behave much differently then bikes, so they could be a very distinct unit. The Ares is a line breaker, vindicator on steroids.

      Delete
    8. 300 for a demo & flamers? That Thing will Shoot 2 at best, Before it gets trashed in melee.
      I would rather have smth that can Carry Units!


      @Roy
      Well Most DA Players will have had a Army Prior to the next dex. And i hate the policy of "nerfing Old , Buffing New" as Seen with carnifex & trygon. I dont want to have to dump my Army becaus some GW Guy Thinks they'll make more Profit. They can make the jetbikes for Vanilla so everybody can use them instead of creating more noobisch flavor of the Month chamelion Proxi SM Players.

      But maybe some People think Thats the Way the Hobby should be. Play SM and change Color as Need be for rule buff????

      Delete
    9. You're also assuming it stays 300 points, which I would bet that it wouldn't. Blood Angel Land Raiders got deep strike at no extra point cost, and the Ares drops troop capacity to 6 to carry the Demolisher, so I'd bet it'd be 250 like all the others. So what if it dies to PClaws/Chainfists/etc, all vehicles do. I just want a hard to kill Ordinance weapon for a marine army that isn't a Guard vehicle. (I play for fun, competitions are fun but a lot more stress then I care for)

      Astalen (@work)

      Delete
    10. I suppose you pay the 300 for the reward factor (risk be damned). Sure it may only fire twice, but at str10 ap2 large blast? I'd own one just for the fun of it. You might lose it quickly, but a little luck on the scatter roles and it can be a complete game breaker by turn two (hell, the thing could win the game for you turn one, depending on what you're lucky enough to annihilate).

      Delete
    11. Jet bikes shouldn't go to vanilla marines because that WOULD make regular bikes obsolette. However, I think they could fit in Ravenwing. Orks can have jetbikes (deffkoptas) and bikes, they can even have bikes as troops! They fill different roles in the army, bikes are anti-infantry with their only anti-tank being giving a Nob a Power-klaw, deffkoptas can take twin-linked (huge deal for orks) rokkits (only way I EVER see them played) and become very mobile anti-tank units. So they don't compete tend to compete with bikes, but warbuggies instead! (similar weapon load-outs but has AV rather than toughness and saves)
      Jetbikes for Ravenwing could be equally filling a different niche. I know you can get attack bikes for anti-tank Multi-Meltas but jetbikes could fill other niches (because they'd be competing with landspeeders too!) like having new shiny Power Lances or (if they were very limited in max number for balance) they could be equipped with plasma cannons like Sammael? So yeah, sorry for going on a bit but that's everything I have to say about jet bikes! :P

      Delete
    12. Lets say they Give em Plasma & Scout & 2W a Bit like orkkoptaz.

      Why would i Ever Take Bikes again?
      RW bikes are realy Bad antitroop Even with flamer. They are to expensive. If you Give Thom melta & Pf. They can be somewhat Good anti Tank but tradeoff Unit pretty much. If jetbikes Get the above they are better anti Tank (vs Most Av10 11 Rear) and will also be much better in melee immun to instanddeath and Hard to would. A Big squad like that can be Auto win. I played s Apoc Game were a Big 15 Kopta squad just wouldnt die. And that was in 5th. Depending on rules they Could be op and if you can Take them in Nr. what Good are Bikes any longer? Koptaz are bad enough To deal with... imagin them with 3+

      Delete
  17. Are the Ares pattern the one with the seige breaker cannons (basically a vendicator Land Raider)?

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    Replies
    1. Yeah its a worse demolisher -.-

      I dont understand why People want stuff you can allready use kitbash or in Case of jetbikes Even BuY.... They just want the Same stuff in plastic for cheaper. How Not NEW

      Delete
  18. I believe the Ares to be the WW style LR.

    -Hesporos

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  19. So excited!!! Rumored release is November, no? Also how many new sculpts will we see (asmodai, ezekial, azrael, belial, etc)?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Rumour is either November, or some time in the New Year. Probably the New Year IMO with the way things are going

      Delete
  20. Reading about their banner options got me thinking. If the new dex for Chaos makes you lose the bonuses from an icon/mark when the bannerman dies, I will be pissed.
    >Mark of Khorne dies
    >A hurr durrr guise r we worhippin a kaos god errr

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The way I remember it, you only lose the effects of the icon when the icon bearer dies. You keep the effects of th mark. Which, in my mind, makes sense.

      Delete
    2. Yeah, that's what it's supposed to be like in the new dex coming out from what I've read. In the current one though, you lose every bonus gained from the standard when it dies iirc.

      Delete
    3. No, they keep the effects of the mark you just don't reduce scatter near the icon anymore (as there it's no icon).

      Delete
    4. Ah I never knew that, thanks. That's a lot better than what I thought it was haha.

      Delete
  21. These rumors, or maybe the beta units that are behind them, just keep on getting more awkward and confusing.

    I worry about the options being too expensive. There seem to be come options but most of them seem pretty clunky and expensive. I hope those banners are cheap and that the Skyfire Whirlwind is heavy2... Maybe special characters and psychic lists will work out though.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Right, ahem, my opinion:

    I can see more value in the Land Speeder for taking out aircraft. However, the Whirlwind and Cyclone Missile Launcher are both options I'd consider. At least cyclone Termies get their storm bolters too.

    Loving the plasma rules for Dark Angels, it would mean lots more plasma pistols, plasma guns and plasma cannons in my army.

    Predator plasma cannon turret, oh yes I want to get that! 3 S7 blasts rather than 2 S7 shots makes that much better than the traditional Autocannon Predator.

    Liking the rumours. Hope to see plenty more!

    ReplyDelete
  23. For those that don't know, the Land Raider Ares is equipped with a Demolisher cannon on the hull and twin-linked heavy flamer sponsons. If we get it and are REALLY lucky, they might give us the option for Plasma Cannon Sponsons... *drool*

    Astalen (@work)

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    Replies
    1. I'd say we'd be lucky to get it at all... quick question though, this thing already has an official set our rules from gw. Can we not already use it? Or is the issue a lack of a kit?

      Delete
    2. Ofc you can use it if yyoure Opponent doesnt mind. But i dont See why People want that Thing. The rules were wrighten to Show of how People can make Own statlines for Apoc. I Think there are enough LR variants.

      Delete
    3. Always fun to have more tanks, I got 4 Raiders with a 5th to assemble, always loved them. Hell, it would fill in the spot of true heavy tank for the marines, as the las LR is not sure what it wants to do (transport/tank hunt). Besides, Dark Angels get themselves into a lot of sieges hunting falling, it fits what they do very well. Plus, I really want a giant bulldozer blade for Raiders, lol. The New Predator has me excited as well, the Tempest though.... I hate putting speeders together.

      Astalen (@work)

      Delete
  24. Personally I'm happy just to have a decent dark angels rumor set everybody has been going on and on about chaos and.whomever it is that is arguing about csm or da first etc. Knock it off ok it is really annoying to see the same running argument in every set that is about csm or da i personally play da but i am still happy that csm is getting a dex soon. The only thing i am hoping for is when the da dex comes out and soon i hope is that it follows previous dexs with great detailed entries variety and ability to make an army that has personality not just competitive and some new fluff would be nice! I was hoping for a storm raven or talon but if not that is what allies r for :-) so i hope csm comes out soon so people will stop going on about it and other armies ie da personally will get some rumor time

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    Replies
    1. I agree, I'm simply glad to be hearing rumors. Some I like some I do not, but I just like to hear that things are moving along, albeit through rumors.
      I was so wrong about that ares LR...

      -Hesporos

      Delete
  25. Surprise! Your "new" Codex is mostly just stuff that has existed for years in Forge World books (that other chapters already have)

    Helios: FW
    Plasma pred: FW
    Tempest: FW
    Mortis: FW

    ReplyDelete
  26. Because we really need ANOTHER version of the Tempest rules. IA:2, IA:2 Update, IA: Apoc 2, IA: Aero, and now C:DA.

    ReplyDelete
  27. All the Anons commenting on how its all just Forge World Stuff, it's now in a GW book and legal without your opponent's consent.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. FW stuff IS legal without your opponent's consent

      Delete
    2. No it isn't. Tell me the page number, cause as of the moment, the Forge World rule stuff requires opponent's consent - bottom of page 3 in Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2nd edition says just that.

      Delete
    3. Imperial Aeronautica book

      Delete
    4. Don't have that book yet, but I doubt that it says that much, otherwise it would have been a bigger deal when it released (gotta order it now).

      For all our sake, I hope GW finally says a yes or no on this subject.

      Delete
    5. It essentially says that FW made models are approved by GW in regular games. Barring Apoc units.

      Delete
    6. In the Imperial Armour: Aeronautica book, P4, it says:

      "This unit is intended to be used in 'standard' ames of Warhammer 40,000, within the usual limitations of Codex selection and force organisation charts. As with all our models, these should be considered 'official', but owing to the fact they may be unknown to your opponent, it's best to make sure they are happy to play a game using Forge World models before you start."

      Delete
    7. In other words, Congrats DA on your "new" collection of Forgeworld units that Vanilla has had for years.

      Delete

 
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