You asked for it, I figured I would post it. Here is the battle for the rumor mill involving Ghost21 and via Aaron Dembski-Bowden. I will set this up a little with some common sense first before we get directly into Aaron's comments.


What are rumors. There are many levels of "real rumors". Mostly they come from the design and development phase of the project, which many different ideas are used and thrown out. (i apologize if I use terms from my run in architecture, its my background, and I have no idea what GW calls design and development). Many ideas are used, and tested during this, and many are thrown out. The beginning of the project during conceptual design, no idea is bad, it helps refine what the end product will be.

I would be surprised if 30-40% of what is originally discussed makes it into a codex. Down the road during the development of a project, ideas are still injected into the project as the codex begins to take shape and gets tested. These are often the ideas that we get some privy to in the form of rumors. Some turn out true, some false, but most have a hint of what is going on in the codex.

Other rumors come from proof-readers (like a couple of my sources), and other people involved in finishing a codex and getting it ready to print. This is just a quick summary of where rumors come from. They are not people that are privy to the final project (most of the time). They are people that have seen the codex, or are involved in its creation, at some point of its writing.

Matt Ward of Phil Kelly do not just sit down and write a codex from start to finish like most people think.

So when it comes to an author of the Black Library getting personally involved in the rumor mill it is going raise some eyebrows. First off, because he can't get involved in this, if he was going to, use a different name for pete's sake. Regardless, I do not know how the writers like Aaron and members of GW get together to discuss information.

Personally the whole thing smells like a smelly crotch queen, but I will let you decide who that is.

Comments that get out of control, are degrading/demeaning to either Ghost21 or  Aaron Dembski-Bowden will be removed. Keep it civil.


via Aaron Dembski-Bowden
The more rumours I check out, the more I see that are clearly false.

"Ghost21" seems to be the one spouting the most nonsense. Whether I was privy to actual Codex rumours or not is pretty irrelevant when there are several points I can flat-out say "Nope" to, in regards to how the IP department explains the fluff to us, and when the rumours are pretending to use characters that the codices are essentially not allowed to touch / wouldn't use without asking us what those characters' fates actually are.

There's even been several people at GDUK this year saying Mat Ward specifically said he's not writing to the Chaos Codex, yet ghost21 insists he is.

Seriously, don't get your hopes up over his rumours.


via ghost21
I'm not exactly sure what to say to that one... regardless.

If he is who he says he is, why take such a hard ass attitude?

He could friendly say "nope", or "I dont think so" or in fact I invite him to come here and talk it over in PM. I mentioned the red angel and little horus (it could have been some guys conversion but he was fairly confident he would make it ).

And if he says who he says he is, we've actually met at those IP meetings.

oh and one last thing writers are told who dies n who doesn't not the other way around


via Aaron Dembski-Bowden
if he is who he says he is why take such a hard ass attitude?

I'm not taking any attitude, really. I'm only pointing out the rumours I know are either false, or exceedingly unlikely to bear fruit.

Bear in mind how anyone in the company hears X or hears Y, from sources A, B and C. I'm not - and will never - share what I have or haven't heard about codex or army book development. Just making that clear. No one in my position would. I don't even hint whether I know anything. I say nothing about it. I like my career and have no interest in losing it.

However, purely as a member of the Heresy team and someone who suckles directly from the core lore sources, some of those rumours are either patently false, or ring hollow with how the IP seems to be presented / was explained to several of us / has been mentioned as being presented in the future.

This is what I said on B&C in my original comments on the subject. Before anything gets out of hand, I'd like to make it clear that I was specifically talking about a couple of points, most notably HH characters in the codex:

"For the record, the Red Angel showing up would surprise me just as much as the separated Renegade/Legion codices, since he's showing up in the Heresy in ways even we've not fully decided yet (we only recently decided who he was), and the IP department are fully aware of it, having been at* the meetings."

(*or privy to)

I'm not making any comment on the other stuff. If I happened to be friends with people at head office and interacted with them professionally and/or personally (which I am, and do) I'd still say nothing. Which is the same thing I'd say if I knew nothing at all. I like my job, hence why I have no interest in risking it.

Purely as an HH writer, I'd be - shall we say - stunned to see certain characters show up in the next Chaos codex, especially when we've only just decided who they are, and their fates aren't decided. That just doesn't strike me as likely.

15 Comments:

  1. As some one who has been involved with this side of things I can 100% say that this statement:

    "oh and one last thing writers are told who dies n who doesn't not the other way around"

    Is wrong.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Oh, I can just feel the horror of 40k fans everywhere when we reach the final books of the heresy series (if ever lol):

    Sanguinius defeats horus but, just as the death stroke is about to strike, the chaos gods snatch the warmaster away. Horus lives, and he's been leading the Black Crusades.

    Sanguinius turned to Khorne and ripped apart the Emperor. Dorn killed Sanguinius. This is the horror the Blood Angels suffer, the horror of knowing their Primarch betrayed the Emperor.

    Like all good relationships in fiction, Leman Russ and Magnus the Red hated each other but are now having a bromance in the warp. The Battle of the Fang was actually the Dark Angels.

    Luther has always been loyal to the Emperor, as have the Fallen, it was Lion'el Johnson who turned to chaos and sacrificed the loyalist in order to ascend to daemonhood. It wasn't the daemon Magnus who attacked the Fang, it was the daemon Johnson for the reason that the Space Wolves learned the truth from Cypher.

    That's all I have for now. If you want to know more I'd be happy to make something up.

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  3. big new :P
    ghost21 is a troll! :D

    if any of his rumors ever are true its by pure random luck.
    everybody can make up 100 lies and have 1 of them come true by random luck

    according to him its allready 3CSM 3other armys comeing out in 2012 for 40k ALONE!!!
    + 6th ED and all the WFB and LOTR stuff aswell

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  4. My local gw guy told me this, leaving out his/her name for obvious reasons. february is tau, march woodelves, april black templars, may bretonnians, june is chaos, july 6th edition, august is two ne starter sets; ambush at kelmark secundus and extermination of mirathandier, first is sm vs de and second is eldar ulthwe vs chaos black legion , something to do with 13th black crusade is my guess,september is eldar, october is vc as the person said white dwrf updates only ever last 1 to 1 and a 1/2 years, so i then pointed out sob, which they said think repentance is new start, january is new year, but to me that is to soon after a new edition has just been released and other codexes, ie sm are probably more important , november is some new tomb kings models and some 40k stuff. december is christmas as usual.

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  5. ghost 21 contradicts himself with saying there should be about 6 new 40k releases this year and that before whfb and lotr are even started, i must say that it is odd for one person to know so much apperently to be true, i mean is gw having an epiphany and deciding that they should release more? possible but highly unlikly, I think ghost 21 is right people but he just hears so many ideas working in gw but puts them all down before he relise that some overlap/ contradict. even now some things probably still not finalised for next year.

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  6. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  7. If you've been anyone who's been reading comments about rumours then you'd know this Aaron person hasn't been the first to call ghost out over his statements.

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  8. Prolific BL Library vs a 50/50 internet troll...

    I wonder who I will back.

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  9. Google: 'lexicanum Red Angel'

    All will be revealed. Though I doubt he who was known as the 'Red Angel' will be seen in miniature form.

    ReplyDelete
  10. @above

    Did what you suggested:

    "Angron (also known as the Red Angel) is the Primarch of the World Eaters. He fell to Chaos during the Horus Heresy, afterwards becoming a Daemon Prince of Khorne."

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  11. I you think that's really ADB then you're an idiot.

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  12. I believe Ghost has actually said there will be three 40k codices releases next year. Same number as this year.

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  13. Anon, that actually is ADB. He's confirmed it on his blog.

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  14. Aaron is a great author at the Black Library who plays Skyrim, scratches his head a lot because of excessive itching, (taken from his own personal blog), and comments on rumors with his own name when he should not be. I give his comments as much weight as Ghost's.

    Ghost has been doing rumors now for some time, is said to work at Games Workshop, was the first mention Dreadfleet, and has a percentage of about 50% accuracy (not a % done by me, but one of his detractors), and has had several 6th edition rumors confirmed by others (his detractors claim they just repeat ghosts rumors).

    Personally, I love Aarons books. He is one of my favorite warhammer writers for the Black Library. I think he stuck his foot in his mouth on this one, which is why he should of not commented in his own name. This melodrama now is the first thing I will think of when I see his name on his next book. (I will still read it though.)

    Ghost just says what he knows, sees, or hears. Much of his rumors are not confirmed or in anyway from a final product that he is giving us, which is why it is what it is. I like it this way. If they are even partially true, it gives insight we would not have otherwise.

    Of course this is all just my personal opinion.

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  15. Arguing about the accuracy of the rumors is just not that interesting, they will prove true or false as things develop. There's no point in getting into it about them, there are a lot of reasons why something could be true or false.

    ADB is Aaron Dembski-Bowden, I met him at the Bowie Battle Bunker and we talked about threads on Bolter and Chainsword. Definitely the same man.

    Ghost 21 works for Games Workshop as a marketing specialist. He has some involvement with people in the US who sell to independent stores, several of whom I know and have vouched for who he is.

    While GW claims that no information will be forthcoming about new releases, that is not entirely true. The 'leaks' he puts out there are actually authorized and serve as a form of test marketing. What I understand is that various blogs and forums (especially Bolter and Chainsword, Dakka Dakka and Warseer) are closely monitored for feedback as a means of quality assurance.

    If you think about it, look at the amount of debate going on about new releases. This is a lot of buzz around rumors, and is probably on par with the levels you see for Apple products on a per-capita basis. There is no way the company would tolerate unauthorized disclosures at this level about upcoming releases unless it was part of a larger strategy to gauge the levels of stock they will need when launching new products.

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