Right around the corner Ogre Kingdoms will be hitting the shelves. Its been amazing at how well Games Workshop has been holding onto the latest codex's to control the volume of rumors floating around. So today I am going to start off with a collection of rumors to help give a heads up at what we are expecting out of the new codex.
Warning, This post is long, especially when it gets down to the question and answers.
We have seen most of these over the last several months, but if your memory is like mine, seeing it all in one place is nice.
The rumor compilations come to us via Darnok
+2 special characters
- Hunter (Stonehorn mount option?)
- fire wizard thingy
+2 special characters
CORE: Sparse compared to other races, trends in counts-towards-minimum core units (and total) -- SK: 4(6), BM: 4(5), OG: 7(??), TK: 5(5)
- Gnoblar Fighters
SPECIAL: 6+ options is typical trend (SK: 6, BM: 6, OG: 10, TK: 8)
- Sabertusk Riders
- Scrap Launcher thats RARE
- Stonehorn* speculation, may be rare RARE
-- Gnoblar Trappers are rumoured to not be in the new book (maybe an upgrade for Fighters?) - got that second bit right by the sound of it.
Originally Posted by eastern barbarian
There is no special character called Jared and Golfang/Golfgang (not sure how you spell him?) will NOT be a n unit upgrade. That is of course not confirmed, but so far my source had been really spot on.
As for magic- all i managed to find is that ogres have 3 augment spells, direct damage spell, hex spell and magic missile spell . Signature spell is also an augment.
According to eastern barbarian, there are 4 new special characters in the book, even though according to 75hastings69 only 2 of them will get a model at this point of time.
Originally Posted by eastern barbarian
From ogre kingdom about new fire-wizard mini:
"Apparently, the mini is holding a flaming torch and is fire-breathing as in the circus act style. Still haven't seen it myself though." -sounds good.
I'll add more on it as it comes across:
Ogre Magic has been reworked and spellcasting now works the same way as for all wizards. Spells are pretty much similar to what they used to be, except they last until next magic phase and are not RIP. Lore attribute is bloodgruel - on 2+ mage gains 1 wound and +1 to cast for his next spell, on a 1 takes an S6 hit.
Ogre mages can take great maw, death, heavens and beasts magic.
New mage model is the firebelly, who uses lore of fire, costs araound a fifth more than an empire cannon, can be upgraded to lvl 2 for the standard price of a wizard upgrade, can take a great weapon or extra hand weapon and has S4 breath attack, flaming attacks and 4+ ward vs fire.
Magic items and big names:
Big names still there and come out of magic item allowance. Didn't get changed that much from what you currently have. Best one is probably giantbreaker - doesn't require giant in the army - for the cost of dispel scroll model can't refuse challenges or flee but gets +1S.
Magic items are few and generally meh compared with common items. Thundermace basically gives you one thundercrush attack just like the sphinx has for a ton of points. Most interesting item is hellheart, which causes a miscast in all enemy mages within 5xD6" at the beginning of enemy magic phase - one use only, costs 2 scrolls.
Core units now include ironguts at five points less than they used to be, and with all command models costed at +10 points (which is same across the book).
You can get 40 gnoblars for the cost of one dark elf sorceress, and they come with throwing weapons attached and no prerequisites.
Special units got a lot of changes, leadbelchers will now fire D6 shots every turn, no misfires, and are move and fire with no penalty for moving. They cost one point less than Yhetees, which cost one point less than talisman of preservation.
Maneaters are half an empire cannon in points, and basically choose two special rules (you cannot chose the same special rule for two units) from a group of 8 - including poisoned attacks, sniper, stubborn, swiftride, strider, vanguard, itp, scout.
Mournfang cavalry is the new heavy cav, with a lot of options (potentially a 2+ armour save), tons of attacks and a price tag that is in the vicinity of a bloodcrusher, depending on what armour/weapons you take. 3 wounds, D3 impact hits and a total of 7 attacks per model make them somewhat fearsome.
Gorger is now special and gets a bit more expensive, but loses the rule by which it had to end movement closer to an enemy unit. It does have frenzy, unbreakable, killing blow and ambusher special rules.
Scrapalauncher is rare, slightly cheaper I think and similar to what it does now (S3 KB catapult)
Ironblaster is an empire cannon with horrible fluff and a pretty unpleasant misfire chart. It is nearly as expensive as a hydra, but has move and fire, S10 grapeshot and a special rule that allows you to roll two dice for bounce and chose the highest, even if one is a misfire.
The two mammoth-like critters are:
the stonehorn, which can have a mounted harpoon launcher (S6 D3 wounds 36" bolt thrower that doesn't penetrate ranks and is move and fire if mounted), 4+ armour save, does a lot of S6 impact hits on the charge, has dragon-like stats (but lower WS, Ld and initiative), M7, 4+ armour save and a special rule which halves the damage from all multiple-wound weapons that hit it.
the thundertusk, which is a support version of the above - has a mounted catapult that doesn't get hurt in any way by misfires, a harpoon and a 12" S6 KB weapon (chaintrap) - 3 weapons on its back, and gives all enemy models within 6" ASL. The tradeoff is - no impact hits and one less attack.
Both of these big beasties cost as much as around 5 wraiths.
A stonehorn can also be the mount for a hunter, which costs almost as much as a high elf prince.
Last but not least: the sabertusk. Special unit, 1-10 unit size. Each one has 3 S4 attacks, so aside from being the redirector of your dreams, it can sometimes work as a mage assassin. One costs slightly more than 4 halberdiers. T4 and two wounds.
They can't use general's leadership or battle standard re-roll, and their own LD is 4 - and can only be joined by a hunter - so I would say they will only come in two unit sizes - 1 or 10+hunter. This second option is not so bad - the unit will cost you some 350 points, but it has vanguard, swiftstride, and 30 S4 WS4 I4 attacks + whatever the hunter brings.
A compilation of rumours from Scammel:
Originally Posted by Yrrdead
Ironfists are literally shields in every way. No other bonuses unless you're mounted.
For larger units though, they're worthwhile, they're only a (current) Gnoblar for a 5+/6+ save (Bulls come with LA 'for free') and larger units will be getting plenty of support attacks to make up for the lack of additional hand weapons (which coincidentally are half a Gnoblar).
They have more options, but not necessarily 'fancy' ones. They get access to full command and a magic banner and can have 'Ogre pistols', additional hand weapons and 'fists, but that's it. No more CLSs in the book, not even for characters. (In reference to ME's)
Yhetees can have a cheap (read: auto-include) Greyback but have no other options.
Minimum size of 3 (a pain, I know) and stubborn is one of the 8 special rules they can pick from. (In reference to ME's)
Yhetees are exactly as they are in SoM (so yes, flammable). Not a clue about Maneater command models.
Maneaters can have great weapons.
The only army-wide rule Ogres get is 'Ogre Charge'.
Big names pretty much as before, some got slightly cheaper, one in particular quadrupled in cost (and I'm betting many sad Ogres will know which one it is).
Ogre Charge is Bull Charge without the min. distance requirement. Additional strength is added per additional rank bonus, and a roll of 10 or more on the charge dice means D3 hits per Ogre.
Mournfangs and Stonehorns have their own rules for impact hits. With the former it's simply D3, with the latter it's 3D3, but if it rolls 10 or more on the charge dice it's 3D3+3. However, the Stonehorn may not attack normally when it charges (but may still TStomp).
Leadbelchers fire D6 shots and suffer no penalties for move and shoot/multiple shots, but are 'slow to fire' and the cannon give no bonus in combat. They're min. size 3 and are 6 Gnobs cheaper.
Riders are just Bulls (FYI, Bulls are now just called 'Ogres').
Mournfangs are S5.
Mundane stuff is a bit cheaper. Not massively, but every little helps.
Originally Posted by Dr. Who
Q: Did the average Ws is still 3? Any character upgrade inside units ? What about the background , is changed ?
A: 1. Yes 2. No 3. Not really changed except in a couple of instances, mostly expanded on. Some really cool and humorous bits in there.
Q: So that no hero or lord can join a unit of cav?
A: They can, but it'd be a silly idea.
Q: The ogres no weapon? + 10 pts for IF?
A: I may have misunderstood your question - there are no special character upgrades for units. Most units have equipment/command options of some sort, in fact more units no have access to command than there were before.
Q: [On Mournfang movement rate] Move 7 I reckon?
A: I believe it's 8.
Q: Also, if hunter join a unit of tusks, can he have any spc rules
A: The Hunter and Sabretusks both get vanguard if they are deployed together.
Q: Can they have a magic banner in the new book? If they can is it limited to only one Irongut unit in the army?
A: Yes and yes, but Ironguts are just one of 3 units that can have a magic standard, not including the BSB.
Q: Do maneaters get 2 special rules by default, or it is more like an upgrade so you could run them with only 1 special rule or even none to make them cheaper?
A: 2 special rules for 'Eaters by default, no more, no less, no cost, no duplicate rules across the army (which unfortunately means a maximum of 4 units of 'em ) but they must be noted in the army roster.
Q: On Ogre Pistols, Gnoblar upgrades, Giants, Stat changes.
A: Ogre Pistols may be taken singularly or as a brace, identical to what they were before but without the +D6 range to the first shot.
No tooth/sword/luck Gnoblars, but look-outs are still in.
The Slavegiant is a copy and paste job from the O&G book.
No stat changes for any existing units.
Q: Does the thundertusk have armor save same as stonehorn ?
Is GreatSkull/Glittering scale/Greypack belt still there ? (ie : can we have a tyrant of antidoom?)
A: 'Tusk has only a 5+ save. Greatskull and Pelt gone.
Q: Can you give us a list of the magic items?
A: Thundermace (pretty similar but more expensive), Siegebreaker (more expensive, a bit worse in some respects, but potentially very useful in Watchtower games), Thiefstone (more expensive, MR2 and another, rather unique effect - lock up your valuables!) Greedyfist (no longer armour, +1S, 6+ ward, only eats weapons on the 6+ save, more expensive) Rockeye (cheaper), Hellheart, Grut's Sickle (more expensive, inflict a wound to gain +2 to cast for the phase, but the other Ogres may not be too happy...) Gut Maw (more expensive, heavy armour, terror and usual effect), Runemaw and Dragonhide (both described elsewhere).
Q: Do we know if our Butchers get spells random like other armys or can we buy them like the rumour had been saying awile back? Also is there anyway to get Loremaster?
A: Casters need to roll for spells, no way to get Loremaster (not even with Skrag).
Q: How about hunter ? Did he get any improvement ? (beside taking cats). It seems he costs more now.
A: Not really any better by himself, but he does at least have more options (weaponry, Stonehorn... and a BIRD).
Q: Talking about Skrag, how does he look on the paper? I enjoyed the current incarnation alot, is there still a killing tally?
A: Slight cost increase, asides from that he's 99% unchanged.
Q: Is the scraplauncher the same as its current state besides the drop in price?
A: Small blast, extra Gnoblars, no bad-tempered, slight misfire adjustment (one result gives it Spawn movement, for example).
Q: Leadbelchers, do they suffer a penalty for long range?
A: Yes, but their range has doubled.
Q: (Runemaw) Basically it makes the unit carrying the standard untargetable by spells, but the opponent can choose to redirect it anywhere else they want. For the redirection, would the range of the spell be measured from the Runemaw unit or from the original casting position of the enemy mage?
A: It's as though the mage simply casts the spell again, the distance from the banner and the new target has nothing to do with it.
Q: They kept Rock Eye in the item list? That doesn't make any kind of sense.
A: It is very cheap.
Q: Unless my math has failed me completely, wouldn't that give ogres 10 magic items instead of the usual 8?
A: Indeed it does.
Q: Maybe it steals magic items so ours aren't so underwhelming?
A: The Thiefstone comes with it's own little table of some BRB talismans/enchanted items which you roll for at the start of the game. If any other character (friend or foe) is already using said talisman, they lose it.
Q: What about mounts option for tyrant?
A: No mounts for Tyrant. At least it results in more Hunters being used (I hope)? The only character in the book who can be mounted is the Hunter, and only on a Stonehorn.
Q: IS that small blast s3 kb? Center no double strength? Is the rhinox same as storm of magic so that it had stubborn etc? Also, do it court as chariot as before?
A: The entire template is S3 KB. The Rhinox is not stubborn. It still counts as a chariot.
Q: How good is Ironblaster in close combat ? It seems a ogre with rhinox..so does it count as chariot too?
A: It's pretty much a T6 Scraplauncher with a single Ogre and single Gnoblar, so pretty potent in combat.
Q: After so much infos i'm still missing something imho very important about stonehorn and the mammooth (i don't remember the name)...
A: [Stonehorn has dragon-like stats (but lower WS, Ld and initiative), M7, 4+ armour save and a special rule which halves the damage from all multiple-wound weapons that hit it
thundertusk - one less attack.]
Think of them as WS3 Dragons and you're not far off. Not as tough as Sphinxes and Araknaroks, but not far off and probably more effective in combat (in the Stonehorn's case at least).
Q: Do the rhinox form Ironblaster and Scrap Launcher just same stats as old version?
A: The Rhinox are WS3, S5, A3. Don't forget, both units are chariots, so that should help answer your other questions.
Q: Seems is the only way for Ok for remove cheap hordes/oversized unit
A: Or you could summon the Maw.
'The Maw' is the new uber-spell. Predictably, it uses the small round template and can be boosted to use the large one, but is direct damage as opposed to vortex. It'll usually scatter and then forces an I test. Those that pass take a S3 hit from the teeth, those that fail take a S7 hit doing D6 wounds.
Bonus titbit: There's a new executioner special character who other Ogres are scared witless of, primarily because he's got a weapon which can get around a gut-plate and deliver a nasty disemboweling, a wound that is painful, fatal and always results in a slow death as it takes a while for an Ogre's guts to spill. Awesome fluff, pic and model, but in-game he's less like an Ogre grim reaper and more like Koko, the Lord High Executioner (props if you actually know who Koko is).
Q: Is that special character on a rhinox still a possibility?
A: No, Golgfag and Bragg the Gutsman are the only 2 new special characters.
Q: It is a Maneater on kitty? O_O Cause he got a ogre pistol look like ...
A: It is a pistol, but that's just an upgrade for the 'Fang champion.
Q: Any hint on what the blood vulture does?
A: [From Eastern Barbarian] Vulture is long distance attack that ignores ANY cover with same S as handgun and distance of handgun plus 50%
Originally Posted by Dr. Who
Q: The Firebelly seems very cheap if he's got butcher-stats (t5w4 etc)?
A: [Eg Giant-Tripper] The Firebelly has exactly the same stats as a Butcher AFAIK.
Q: On Gnoblar options:
A: [jtrowell] Also, gnoblars can now can have full command (yes, including banner and musician), and the champion is half the usual price for the command upgrade (other command upgrades have the new default 5-gnoblars cost). ... but Sharp stuff is now only a normal throwing weapon, so no more multi-attacks.
Trappers are a unit upgrade every model in enemy unit that successfully charged the gnoblars to take a Dangerous Terrain test… …It's every model in the enemy unit, as long as the Gnobs are charged in the front arc.
Q: Is the presence of Trapper upgrades in Gnoblar units revealed at deployment or are they hidden until the unit is charged?
A: There's nothing about the nature of Trappers in regards to representation, the opponent's knowledge etc. I assume it's totally appropriate to keep quiet about them as you might keep quiet about any other invisible upgrade, like a stat boost. That said, I doubt it'll ever be a point of contention because you'd be daft to field Gnobs without the upgrade IMO.
Q: Do we know if the insignificant rule is still in for Gnoblars and Ogres?
A: [VooDooChilly] Yea insignificant is still in but now called beneath contempt. No panic on friendly units.
Q: On Mournfang Cavalry options?
A: [VooDooChilly] Btw are people aware that MF riders can have IF or GW
Q: On Hunter options and equipment?
A: [VooDooChilly] Hunter comes with Great Throwing Spears and LA and can take one of the following: XHW, IF, GW or Harpoon, Vulture. Harpoon and Vulture are the same cost.
Blood Vulture missile weapon 36" S4 single shot, Ignore Cover, Quick to Fire
Q: If you could "send out the bird" to scout enemy characters and hidden models in units?
A: [VooDooChilly] Thats what the Rock Eye is for and its half the cost of the Vulture, so you could always take both and say its the Vulture looking around.
Q: Can maneaters take ironfists? In general, what are maneaters weapon and armour options and how expensive are they in gnoblars?
A: [Eg Giant-Tripper, VooDooChilly] Unfortunately I don't think MEs can take IFs. HA is apparently 2 Gnobs, additional hand weapon 1 Gnob, great weapon 5.5 Gnobs, pistol 3.5 Gnobs, brace of pistols 6 Gnobs. Each command option is 5 Gnobs.
Q: How did the Dragonhide Banner change from the current one?
A: [VooDooChilly] Dragonhide is now reroll all 1s on To Hit,To Wound,Saving throws on the turn you charged plus the bearer has S3 Breath Weapon that causes Always Strike Last on the enemy unit until the end of its next turn.
Q: How many Wounds and what toughness do Mournfang Cav. have?
A: [VooDooChilly] 3 and 4
Q: Hunters on foot, can they move and fire with their harpoon launchers?
A: [jtrowell] No, the weapon is only move and fire when the hunter is mounted on a stonehorn.
Q: Any specifics on Goldtooth, other than the early rumors of more combat oriented?
A: Greasus got a bit cheaper, his 4+ ward became a proper ward, he's no longer the BSB, he no longer inflicts additional impact hits, his stupidity ability is limited to 18", he no longer requires Ironguts, put apart from that he's pretty much the same.
Q: Would it be possible for you to go through the Big Names like you did with the magic items?
A: Big names haven't really changed much at all, just point adjustments here and there. Beastkiller is now Hunters only and grants +1 to wound against large targets with both shooting and combat attacks if you're not using a magic weapon. There's a single new one, Brawlerguts, which is quite cheap and allows you to re-roll impact hit wounds.
Q: Does anyone know are the Butchers and the Slaughtermasters still immune to poison?
A: They are.
Q: I wonder if Yhetees still have their -1 to hit and Scale Terrain rules or if Aura of Frost is now the same as in the Storm of Magic book? (-1 WS)?
A: Yhetees are copied and pasted from the SoM book.
Q: Are there any mount options other than a Hunter on a Stonehorn?
Q: And are the leadbelcher cannons much differant whilst Ithink about it?
A: [Hragged] Double the range (with long range penalty), D6 shots each, no misfires, move and fire without penalty, can fire every turn (don't need to spend a turn reloading, thank the Maw), slow to fire, minimum unit size of 3, no bonuses from the cannon in combat, and they'll be cheaper.
…Remeber that leadbelcher's need to hit the enemy so its D6 shot each hitting on 4+ per cannon.
Q: Do we have one or more units in the book without models? Like the Hierotitan or the Mangler Squig?
A: Every unit in the book has a model to represent it and all the new models have been leaked. No more surprises I'm afraid.
Q: Any info on Bragg and Golgfag?
A: Trust me, as long as you keep people aware of what Bragg actually does, no-one can accuse you of powergaming with him, he's very expensive for what he does (to be precise, he's 105 Gnobs for Bruiser stats, LA, S6 and HKB in challenges - furthermore if he kills someone in a challenge, all units in base contact are disrupted for a turn).
Golgfag's alright the vast majority of the time too, providing you don't get too lucky with him/equip him to be abusable (he gets 2D6x10 pts worth of free magic items at the start of the game, has slightly upgraded Bruiser stats, LA, lets one unit of Maneaters count as trusted allies and he costs 130 Gnobs).
…And 20pts of other items potentially. Alternatively, he could just have 20pts of items altogether.
…His cost is fixed. The items are completely free.
Q: Both are heroes then (Bragg and Golgfag), I assume? Are there any further Lord SCs besides Greasus and Skrag?
A: Both are heroes, Greasus and Skrag are the only SC lords. Skrag went up 12.5 Gnobs and remained 99% the same, Greasus went down 10 Gnobs and both improved and got worse in different ways.
Q: Any change about gorger?
A: 7.5 Gnobs more, frenzy replaces 'ravenous', ambushers replaces 'blood scent', special choice. Still single models. Skrag doesn't adjust the slots they occupy or anything like that, but still gives them benefits with his cauldron.
Q: Has anyone heard anything about possible upgrades/armament options for Iron guts?
A: There aren't any.
Q: Colour me stupid, but where is the catapult on the thundertusk? I'm seeing the chaintrap and the harpoon launcher, but no catapult. Is the banner supposed to be a catapult?
A: [Eastern Barbarian] imagine more like special ability that WORKS AS stonethrower
…I don't want to spoil EB's fun in regards to keeping people guessing about the Thundertusk, but it's a children's winter pastime... It's a snowball thrower?? Glad GW is adding a bit of comedy
Q: Does it manifest snowballs with its breath?
A: Pretty much. Okay, they're not actually snowballs, they're called something more threatening but that's what everyone is going to envisage, giant snowballs of DOOM.
Q: So both the Stonehorn and the Thundertusk are rather magical creatures, then?
A: The Thundertusk indeed gives off an aura of cold like the Yhetees. They're also incredibly ancient beasts, around when the Dragons and Dragon Ogres were doing their stuff and I'm not just talking about the general species, the individual beasts are that old.
…[Przemcio251] Well the thingy shooting snowballs is kind of fun especialy if you roll missfire it means you didn't shoot the snowball and thats it no missfire chart
As for Thundertusk's: Moves like a minotaur, fights like a ungor, strong as a doombull, tought like a hellcannon, has wounds like a doombull +1, initiative as a dwarf, has the same number of attacks as exalted hero.
Q: Now if we only knew if the new Leadbelcher shots had AP or not?
A: [przemcio251] Well they are slow to fire and AP may be fired after a move with no mod's to hit...
Q: On the Hellheart?
A: I discovered something I can't beleive I missed - for every wizard you manage to affect with the Hellheart, you gain an additional dispel die.
Q: On Ogre Handguns?
A: Multiple shots (Brace), armour piercing, quick to fire. Job's a good 'un.
Q: Can you employ some Ogre units as DoW in other lists?
A: The Dogs of War rule has gone completely.
Q: Does the poison effect on maneaters affect shooting attacks?
A: You're right Avian - it doesn't specify so it applies to both shooting and CC attacks.
Q: On Skrag old special rules?
A: Skrag allows Gorgers to be taken in units of up to 2 and ignore the usual restrictions on duplicate choices.
Q: That being said, is it definatly confirmed that Big names come out of magic item allowence?
A: Big names come out of the item allowance. It's such a shame that all but a couple will never see use, like last time.
Q: How much is giantbreaker? Would work well with either fencer's blades or sword of striking...
A: Same price, same effect, can't opt to flee or deny challenges, no Giant requirement. One of the better ones if not the best.
Q: Scammel, i am sorry if someone already asked or mentioned, what is the max pts of banner can the OK unit take? both of this three unit max 50 pts magic banner? Also, any of the unit's champion can take magic item? Last, do hunter have any range weapon he can take if not mounted?
A: Ironguts, Maneaters and Mournfangs are limited to 50pts per banner. There is no option for any unit champion to take a magic item in the book. The Hunter can take any 3 of his ranged weapons (harpoon, spear and BIRD) whether he's mounted or not.
Q: What does the Hunter’s Throwing spear do?
A: Range 12", S+1, quick to fire. It's alright on foot, but mounted the harpoon is superior.
Q: What is the Harpoon?
A: The harpoon is move or shoot (unless mounted), range 36", S6, D3 wounds, DOES NOT penetrate ranks or ignore armour. Asides from the spear which is free, the Hunter's weapon options are 5 Gnoblars.
Q: Is the bigname Kineater still in the book?
A: Kineater is still in, same effect, 5 Gnobs less.
Q: Is the S4 breath weapon of the Firebelly one use only and can be used in close combat (2d6 S4 hits) as normal breath weapons? Or is it more like lizardmen salamanders, so infinite breaths?
A: It's a S4 flaming breath weapon that acts like an ordinary BRB breath weapon. 60 Gnobs for repeated usage of it would be terrifying.
Q: Can Mournfang Cavalry have Great Weapons?
A: [Przemcio251] You can have either fist or GW the first costs 2.5 gnoblars, the lqtter costs 4 gnoblars.
Q: Is there still the stupid/tough Mawseeker name?
A: [Przemcio251] yes mawseeker + stupidity is still there.
Q: Any Assorted info?
A: [Hitsugaya Toushiro]
-leadbleachers can't stand and shoot
-Stonehorn has the "halves multiple wounds"....the Thundertusk no
-ogres with ironfist are only 16 old gnoblars
-all foot ogres (no mournfang cavalry) can have look-out gnoblar on standard bearer for 2,5 old gnoblars (so you need to buy standard bearer and if he die you lose look out sir on 3+ models)
-rare unit Stonehorn has an ogre beast rider on hit with chaintrap or harpoon launcher for free
-a Stonehorn ridden by Hunter has a special rule that says that ANY SHOOTING ATTACKS against the model are randomized (5+ hunter)......now...normal rulebook rules for templates like cannon balls say that both rider and mount are hit (so a S10 D6 wounds on rider and S10 D6 wounds on mount)......but by rulebook, Army Books rules OVERRIDE rulebook rules......so by RAW it looks like cannon balls on Hunter+Stonehorn only hit 1 of them......if it will not be faqedhat says that ANY SHOOTING ATTACKS against the model are randomized (5+ hunter)......now...normal rulebook rules for templates like cannon balls say that both rider and mount are hit (so a S10 D6 wounds on rider and S10 D6 wounds on mount)......but by rulebook, Army Books rules OVERRIDE rulebook rules......so by RAW it looks like cannon balls on Hunter+Stonehorn only hit 1 of them......if it will not be faqed it's very nice.....hunter on stonehorn could be interesting....a nice Ward save on hunter and the stonehorn halves multiple wounds means a survivable unit....
-stonehorn has frenzy, thundertusk not
-the Great Maw spell is very risky if you roll misfire